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News flash. Today I got invited to a seder. A WRITTEN invitation no less and my mom made me write an acceptance and mail it. There is this guy Mitch in some of my classes and he is Jewish. We have always been friends but not great friends or best friends if you know what I mean. In fact we have had some intense arguments about the Middle East and Israel and the Palestinians becuase I also know a Palestinian girl and I kind of side with them in all that mess. A couple of times we were really mad at each other and we did not speak to each other for a couple of days but then there was a third person to be mad at and Mitch and I were mad at him instead of each other. Lots of drama. Mitch is on the swim team and we have been talking more and more and today he handed me an envelope and said he hoped I could come. That was the invitation to the seder.
I was like whoa! Cool! Dad said I should wear a tie and everything and I can always take it off if nobody else has one on. But the totally weird thing is I have never got any looks from Mitch in the locker room or anything. I mean could he be wanting to be deeper friends? I could mosdef do that because he is actually an awesome guy. I mean a seder is an important thing right? I know Mitch thinks all of us are his friends and we all do lunch together and hang around and we have slept over at each others houses and stuff. But I never thought that Mitch was tight with me like Aaron and some other guys are tight you know?
I feel really pumped about this. I'm no way religious either. We are supposed to be Lutherans but we never go to church not even on Christmas or Easter. I dont think my parents really believe in any of it anyway.
So of course mom had to call Mitchs mom and yak about how great it was for me to be invited and what a nice boy Mitch is (which is true) and how much I am looking forward to it (which is true) and mom asked if I could bring anything and that started like this long winded thing from Mitchs mom about koscherness and she said everything was under control. Mom tried to explain it and it sounded like a ton of trouble if the stuff you would bring was not koscher. They are reformation Jews which is weird because I thought the reformation was Lutheran but I guess he will explain all about this.
So on Tuesday a might be gay Swedish supposed to be Lutheran boy will go Jewish for a night.
He has olive skin and black curly hair and long eyelashes that I heard make girls shit themselves from envy and brown eyes. And he has a treasure trail already.
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Macky
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Really getting into it |
Location: USA
Registered: November 2008
Messages: 973
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Precious!
I love reading your posts Cabinboy.
Thanks,
Max
Behold, how good and how pleasant it is
For brothers to dwell together in unity!
Ps 133:1 NASB
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... LOL, to be that young and bubbly, and so left-foot all over again.
My best advice is just to be yourself, and not to worry a whole lot about any of the rigarmarole that may be going on in the background regarding his family's preparation for the occasion.
His family being "Reform" simply means they are NOT "Orthodox" (you know the whole "hair-curls, ankle-length black coats, beards and wooly Fedoras" thingie) but likely still conform to Kosher handling of their food-stuffs and such. Depending on how far to the right or left of the Reform movement the family may be, this could involve their still maintaining separate kitchens, and place settings, cutlery and preparation facilities for their food, with them separating, and not mixing, "Dairy" with "Meat"; which might account for his mother's advising your mother they had everything in hand and not to worry. As a dinner guest you'll not notice a whole lot of difference, just that there would likely be the absence of one or the other with each food course, and fresh dinnerware with each as served.
His inviting you, a gentile, is actually a really big deal, and it means that sometime or the other you have actually made an impact on this young fellow; but, that that impact would not necessarily be sexual in nature; just that he thinks you're kind of special is all.
Go and have fun ... and you will have fun ... and just be yourself and I'm sure he'll not be disappointed.
Warren C. E. Austin
The Gay Deceiver
Toronto, Canada
[Updated on: Thu, 25 March 2010 03:39]
"... comme recherché qu'un délice callipygian"
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saben
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On fire! |
Registered: May 2003
Messages: 1537
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Sounds great fun, I don't know anything about Judaism, but it sounds like a good experience.
Especially if you he does like you "that special way".
But don't get your hopes up too much over it! Maybe his mum just told him he could invite a friend and you were the first that popped into mind. Nonetheless it's still a privileged and an honor, even if it is platonic.
If it's more than platonic? Well better make sure you start reading up on kosher sex  )
Look at this tree. I cannot make it blossom when it suits me nor make it bear fruit before its time [...] No matter what you do, that seed will grow to be a peach tree. You may wish for an apple or an orange, but you will get a peach.
Master Oogway
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13751
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Just remember that he has invited you as a friend, not as a boyfriend. I had no idea what the word meant until I checked out http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Passover_Seder And it looks like a very formal feast, which means you are privileged to be invited (I think). You will have a wonderful time with great food and excellent company. I suspect you should be prepared for a prayer or two to be said. If unsure what to do, watch fellow guests and do likewise. There is a lot of tradition there. It doesn't matter whether you believe in it, it is something to be enjoyed and respected.
I have no idea if one should bring a small gift for the host or not. I think JFR may be able to tell us. He has some experience of these events and will soon correct any misapprehensions I have!
All relationships start with friendship. The very most you can hope for is to cement a good friendship. Disagreement about the palestinian situation is inevitable, but it is Israel and Palestine who will solve that, or fail to solve it, not you and Mitch. The world has opinions about it, but the world does not live there.
Be his good friend. Find out his opinions about gays. If he mentions Leviticus I know an interesting, if somewhat technical, treatise that will make him think about the apparent prohibition there.
[Updated on: Thu, 25 March 2010 08:34]
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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I didn't know what a seder was any more than Timmy, but when I was 13 & 14 my best friend at school was jewish and when I was invited to his house quite often I found the food was odd - but it was in 1948 and 1949 when food rationing made lots of people eat odd food. In our case it was before either I or Paul had woken up far enough to have sexual feelings for others.
But it was Paul who first opened my eyes to the astonishing differences between people's natural abilities. We played with meccano together and he just couldn't see how a linkage would move before he built it and discovered it would do what he thought.
We lived in West Hampstead in London and it was a very cosmopolitan area with many jewish and asian shops which meant that you could buy milk on a Sunday and we ate quite a lot of kosher food.
Love,
Anthony
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Hey CabinBoy, you will report back, won't you?
if there are prayers, you might have to cover your head. I was at a non-denominational event once where prayers were offered and the person looking after this young Jewish lad produced a pocket handkerchief for the occasion, which I thought was pretty naff for the seriousness of the occasion.
Hugs
Nigel
I dream of boys with big bulges in their trousers,
Never of girls with big bulges in their blouses.
…and look forward to meeting you in Cóito.
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13751
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In what manner was it odd? Do you mean different, or do you mean, like Heinz's attempt at green tomato ketchup, odd?
Might you mean that, unlike the then inglorious english alleged cuisine, this had flavour?
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13751
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Hahahahaa. I'm sure Mitch will tell him if there is any special dress code. Let's all try to scare him off!!
Remember that this is a formal gathering in an informal location. I'm sure that his hosts will have thought of everything and will make sure that no guest is uncomfortable. This will be a glorious meal in great company.
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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Yes - and not just one different flavour - a lot of them. And I was already used to rye bread and pumpernickel and lentils and paella and various risottos. (You may laugh but such food was exotic in those days.)
A lot of it was spicy and I can no longer remember what the spices were. And it was often served a a sort of buffet. Little pieces which you browsed on as you went past.
Love,
Anthony
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Cabin Boy...Your visit to a Jewish home for sedar will be an educational experience, I attended several in my own youth. Being a lapsed Catholic by age 14 I was interested in what others saw in religion.
Judiasm is one of the oldest religions in the world when it comes to traditions. I'm sure you were invited as an act of friendship and kindness. Your attendance will be as much for your sake as Mitch's. He'll score brownie points with his parents.
You may have to wear a skull cap, a yamulke (spelling?)as heads need to be covered. I attended several Bar Mitzvas during my teen years, seems I had a lot of Jewish friends.
This will all be like viewing history. Being an outsider you might even write about it for a social studies class and gain some extra credit. But the ceremony, the prayers and the food will interest you. If you feel you must take a gift then go to the drugstore and buy a card that wishes the family a Happy Passover, the sentiment will be appreciated.
Just enjoy yourself and try not to perv on Mitch in front of his family, you guys can always work those things out later. He does sound attractive, maybe he does like a certain Swedish boy? 
Age appears to be best in four things; old wood best to burn, old wine to drink, old friends to trust, and old authors to read. (Sir Francis Bacon 1561-1626)
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13751
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Ah, well that is not 'odd' so much as 'cosmopolitan'
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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Hi there Cabinboy. Going to your friend's "Seder" will be, I hope, an enjoyable experience for you. Certainly, something new. You say that your friend's family are Reform Jews, so it surprises me a bit that they seem to be very particular about the special "kosher" food that is required for the Passover festival. But, please respect them in this. It would be nice to take them a present: but NOT food. I suggest you play it cool and take Mitch's Mum a lovely bouquet of flowers. You can't go wrong there.
The "Seder" is a family celebration held on the first night of the Passover festival. The word itself means "Order" because there is a ceremony for that evening which follows a traditional order. The festival celebrates the Exodus of the Israelites from Egyptian bondage. (If you want to, you can read up on the story in the first 12 chapters of the book of Exodus in the bible.) The ceremony is lengthy, but have no worries: right bang in the middle is a real slap up meal.
Be prepared to drink four cups of wine during the evening and instead of bread you will be served Matzah (unleavend bread). Since the family are Reform Jews a lot of the ceremony will probably be in English, so that should not bother you too much. Also, the little book that contains the actual "order" of the ceremony, called an "haggadah" will probably have a running English translation; so you shouldn't be bored.
Three last things: thing #1 - don't forget to let us all know how things went on the night (next Monday evening). Thing #2 - if you need any further information you can email me and I'll do my best. Thing #3 - as far as the Israeli/Palestinian thing is concerned: remember there are always two sides to every story, so keep an open mind.
Oh! The greeting used is either "Chag Same'ach" in Hebrew or "A gut YomTov" in Yiddish. Both mean "have a happy festival." You too.
J F R
The paradox has often been noted that the United States, founded in secularism, is now the most religiose country in Christendom, while England, with an established church headed by its constitutional monarch, is among the least. (Richard Dawkins, 2006)
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So last night after I wrote about going to Mitchs for the seder his mom called my mom back again. Since our spring break is all next week she wanted to know if Mitch could invite me to STAY OVER after the seder since it is really long. My mom said it was cool with her and dad so TODAY in school Mitch asked me if I wanted to pack clothes for the seder and go to his house early on Monday and hang out together all day and then get ready for the party and then sleep over and hang out some more on Tuesday. I cant believe this. This is too freaking awesome. I was totally ready for him to ask because I was like you bet! before he even stopped talking.
So today mom says I am not just a dinner guest but a house guest and you know how moms get and she is all up in the air about YOUR MANNERS. Like I have fur and a tail and live in the backyard or something. So I had to sit and get the load on being a good house guest.
So I am taking a card and flowers and they are going to be from a real florist and not just from the Giant.
So then mom springs this one on me and says that she has discussed this with dad and Mitchs parents and IF I WOULD LIKE TO I can invite Mitch for Easter day and Monday and to be our house guest in return. So I was like on my cell instantly and my hands were all sweaty and everything and HE SAID HE WOULD LOVE TO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Thanks for the advice from everybody and for telling me about the seder and I promise to just go with the flow of everything and let Mitch set the game plan and what we are going to do and I will play it totally cool in his bedroom too. He has skylights and dormers which is awesome. Mitch was totally glad I am coming because he has three girl cousins that are a little younger than us and now he said we can duck out after the other guests leave and hang out just the two of us. It is really hard not to think about this 24-7 until Monday.
So tomorrow after school mom is taking me to get some better clothes since I grew out of the ones I had before this and my dad siad I can wear any of his ties that I want. This is going to be so excellent.
So Mitchs family is German so do I say the Hebrew thing or the yiddish thing? There is a little box on side of the front door too that means something important for Jewish people because I saw his grandfather kiss his fingers and then touch it before he went into Mitchs house. Should I do this too? I really totally want to fit in and be a good guest.
Mitch says the food will be so good I will never forget it.I had apple cake there once and it was awesome.
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13751
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It's desperately tempting to do the exact same as they do, but you need to understand the traditions and have them mean something for you personally to "perform" them. The door thingy is one of these: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mezuzah And has no significance for you, so it would probably be patronising to imitate what they do. But it is perfectly permissible to ask the significance of an object or a tradition or a ritual.
To give you an idea, I had an amazing time in Israel recently. A lot of it was spent asking my most gracious and generous host the significance of things that are natural to him and his religion. I didn't follow amy of the traditions simply because I am not Jewish, though I did have a hat with me in case I inadvertently strayed into an area where covered heads are important. As long as one is truly interested in the answer and listens well (which includes further questions) then sensible questions are always welcome.
Hahahahahahha I love the manners talk. You know your manners anyway, but mothers are mothers!
I'm going to guess that you say the one you can pronounce! The history of Yiddish - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yiddish_language - makes me think that it might be appropriate, but what do I know?
i know you are so hoping that Mitch and you might, well, you know, in a way, with stars and stuff, but think carefully about that. What you have today is a great friend. Whatever else happens you want to have a great friend after the sleep over.
A thought is asking some variant, if you are brave enough, of "I hope it doesn't spoil our friendship that I'm pretty sure I might be gay" and simply going with the flow with the answer. After all, if he asks if you are attracted to him you can always say, "You're handsome and great company, who wouldn't be?" but how you act along with what you say is key. And you have to trust your parents to love you unconditionally before you reveal your feelings to anyone.
It sounds like you're in for a great 10 days or so!
[Updated on: Thu, 25 March 2010 22:41]
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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Quick answers.
The best greeting for you to use would be "Happy Passover". Forget about the Hebrew and the Yiddish; if you really want to "impress" you can try the Yiddish, but that will probably get Mitch into paroxysms of laughter, so think twice about that.
What Timmy said about the Mezzuzzah is perfectly correct and you can just ignore it. Indeed, Timmy usually gives excellent advice.
I hope all your expectations are fulfilled - so try not to have too many high expectations!
J F R
The paradox has often been noted that the United States, founded in secularism, is now the most religiose country in Christendom, while England, with an established church headed by its constitutional monarch, is among the least. (Richard Dawkins, 2006)
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saben
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On fire! |
Registered: May 2003
Messages: 1537
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One thing I've learnt by living in different countries is that no-one expects you to be perfect at practising their culture. They only expect you to be respectful towards it.
You don't need to speak Yiddish or do any of the ceremonial things they do. If you make an attempt they will probably see it as cute, though. But on some things they may see it as inappropriate. It's not your faith or culture, after all.
Imagine a non Christian going into a church and taking communion.
Just be respectful, ask questions and I'm sure they'll ensure you don't commit any too horrible faux pas.
Look at this tree. I cannot make it blossom when it suits me nor make it bear fruit before its time [...] No matter what you do, that seed will grow to be a peach tree. You may wish for an apple or an orange, but you will get a peach.
Master Oogway
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