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Garrett
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Toe is in the water |
Registered: January 1970
Messages: 77
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Yeah
I at least have u
Thats about all
I feel so lonely all the time!
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Hiya,
Man, it sounds like a lot of what I went through a when I was your age, mon frer. The things you hear that aren't directed at you yet hurt anyways. The subtle innuendoes and the pressure to just go with the jokes. Its not easy, especially with as homophobic as the world tends to be.
And as much as I'd like to tell you there's an easy answer, or answers, I haven't found any of them easy. One of the only things I've found that helped me through the early years was just this one thing: knowing that I am not a stereotype. A person should be known by their actions, not by what others expect of them. Those who do live by expectations are often proven to be wrong and foolish. Just play chess against someone like that, you'll see.
I'm not sure what the issues are that are giving you the most problems, kiddo. But you will find that just about everyone here has tons of understanding, advice and love. We're here for you, so don't hesitate to ask, or just chat with one of us whenever. We don't pretend to know it all, but I'll tell you this, we are all in it together. There's a kind of kinship in that, and an acceptance beyond what most people are willing to give. And who knows, chances are one of us might actually know exactly what you're going through and have some insight that helps.
Like a lot of us, I'm on AIM. My name there is DArtgnonBlues. Bring us your grief, your tears, your troubles and your tears, and if nothing else, we can share them with you and see what's what.
Hang in there.
It's not the wolf you see you should fear, but all the ones he howls with. Don't be afraid of the song, but don't piss off the choir.
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I know how tough it can be for an Amercian GI's kids in Europe having spent quite a bit of time there myself while in the Air Force. I talked to a lot of kids that felt just the same way. If you wish to talk to a geezer then my email is posted. AIM is zero78245d and YM is zero78245d@sbcglobal.net.
Hugs, Charlie
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Guest
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On fire! |
Registered: March 2012
Messages: 2344
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Trust and faith are two of the hardest medicines to swallow.When you get sick and tired of the cancer that is eating you,try TRUST AND FAITH...This commercial curtesy rbryce
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trevor
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Really getting into it |
Registered: November 2002
Messages: 732
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I sent you a huge rambling e-mail already, the gist of which is we've all got troubles, all been through similar, (yeah, like that helps, I know, but we CAN relate, at least.)
I can't speak from experience, but my understanding is that Germany is much more gay-friendly that the US (especially the bible-belt southern states, for example.) It also seems that quite a few Germans can speak English, unlike "americans" who tend to only speak one language. So, it might be an option to at least make a friend off-base? I can't know your circumstances, just wanted to mention the possibility.
Meanwhile, know that you've already wormed your way into our hearts and have our good thoughts following you around.
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smith
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On fire! |
Registered: January 1970
Messages: 1095
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There's not one person here who doesn't have questions...some get answered, some never do.
Please don't label yourself. You just want to be feel loved and accepted. I think that's everyone's hope and wish. You have plenty of time to figure out what you are as far as the labels go.....right now just figure out who you are. What does Garrett like? What does Garrett need to make him happy? Just small things, like skateboarding, movies, drawing........
I'm 16. I want a normal life too. It's okay to feel weird that you can't talk to the other kids about what bothers you. It's okay that you can't talk to your parents. No 16 year old talks to their parents. You can talk here; no one judges,no one criticizes.......
Don't hate yourself. I've been there, done that. The sweet people here can help if you want them to by listening and making you feel worthy. I know.........I've been right where you are.
Gay/Bi/Str8..........these are just labels that try to lock you into feeling different. Just be Garrett.....start there.
Make friends.....right now, that's much more important than finding some 'one' to love. You've got lots of time for that.
{{{{{hugs}}}}}
smith
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Garrett
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Toe is in the water |
Registered: January 1970
Messages: 77
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I already speak german so thats no problem, but im not out of the closet, and i want to stay that way for now. But I just want to know why I hate my self (aside from my life sucking)
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Garrett
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Toe is in the water |
Registered: January 1970
Messages: 77
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But u see I cant just make friends, I suck at talking to people. I can only speak to everybody here because they dont judge. Thats why I like this site.
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trevor
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Really getting into it |
Registered: November 2002
Messages: 732
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Unfortunately, unless you happen to bump into the rare person like smith who make a point of befriending everyone, most people will find it hard to like you if you don't like yourself.
Try making a list of what you like about yourself. Try to be positive and be specific.
Here's mine - I bet some of these apply to you also:
- I am generally kind and compassionate.
- I'm relatively intelligent.
- I'm not ugly.
- I generally like people.
- I can be a good friend.
- I don't gossip.
- I'm slow to anger.
- I forgive quickly.
Then, like smith said, what are you good at, or enjoy doing? We all have interests and hobbies, or things we'd like to try but never have. Those make you an interesting person and are something worth talking about.
We really have an incredible amount of control over our lives and our thoughts, if you think about it. We have thousands of choices and decisions everyday, but we need to realize that. Think about your options to positively improve your life.
If people get to know you a bit - see a tiny bit of your soul - and know you are a good person - they will be less likely to judge anything "controversial" about you, later. But really, the controversial parts are pretty trivial, I'll bet. I mean, you don't worship the devil, smash small animals for fun, throw rocks at little kids, trip elderly people with canes, poison the cool-aid, stuff like that, right? 
I know, it's hard to do when we're down, you may have to force yourself, you may have to paste on a smile - even for yourself, for a bit - until you can make it a real smile, but YOU can do that. Really, we can be your friend and listen and make crappy suggestions like mine, but only you can change yourself.
Robert has done that. Yes, sometimes I think he's a bit rough around the edges  but he's done the soul-searching and found some things to make him appreciate life and find a bit of peace. (He claims we can smooth those rough edges if we rub them enough the right way . . . hmmm . . .)
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Guest
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On fire! |
Registered: March 2012
Messages: 2344
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keep comming back.maybe not all of the answers you will find,but friends you WILL find here.Take a little time to read some of the stories that Timmy hosts here.Also there is a lot of good information listed on the main page.Most are truely fantastic.Take some time to read (the misfit).An eye-opener to be sure,with one hell of a message.(a suggestion)...If you have access to a printer,download the misfit and leave the story somewhere your father can read the story.ALL hell may break loose,but I dont think that will happen if your father really loves you.And I think thats important to find out.IMPORTANT----Your orientation,what ever it is,is like pouring honey in a paper bag.Sure,the honey may not leak for a few days,but in time,some WILL LEAK OUT,and people close WILL figure out about you.If you think you can hide your feelings,think again.Those closest to you may lable you as deceptive and evasive and lose all respect.Your father sounds pretty tough and strong willed.He will respect that in others also in his son.I know,Ive been there.I asked my father,looking straight in the eye if I could trust him with anything.His answer has haunted my for many years.But,that doesnt have to happen to you.Please do something to find the faith and courage to do whats best for you.Whatever it takes .There are tens of thousands of boys out there,that are living in a kind of fear and self doubt that they see no solution-no way out.Please dont loose yourself to fear-its a killer...robert
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Guest
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On fire! |
Registered: March 2012
Messages: 2344
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you are a good friend.What this place is all about...rob
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Garrett
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Toe is in the water |
Registered: January 1970
Messages: 77
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My orientation isnt anything, I know Im bi. But that doesnt have much to do with this, only the fear that people will find out. But It does have some effect. My father wont understand if Im even bi, and he doesnt trust me to be bi. He'd be soooo mad. Plus some times I dont think that he really does love me, most of the time its like Im not even there! But what good would it do? NONE! Thats one of my problems, because anyone around here found out that I was bi, Id be shipped off to a special "straitening" school, in god know where!
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Guest
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On fire! |
Registered: March 2012
Messages: 2344
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To live in that kind of fear and terror is sad.Its very hard to comprehend how a parent can be so abusive if thats the case.In the 1900s women lived in that kind of fear.You DO have resources that you can use,but from what you are saying,you seem to be throwing them away.This man has a commanding officer,your base has a chaplin--someone you can write a letter to and tell of your terror and fear.You dont even have to give your name.Just post a letter without identifying your self.Perhaps nothing will ever happen and no action will be taken.the point being that you got off your duff and took that first step in taking back your life.As was suggested,small steps may be the only thing you can do.but damn it you gotta start somewhere.If you fear sending a letter to the commanding officer,an internet buddy can do so if he has the COs address. Your name or any other name need not be mentioned.But it sure would be interesting if any response proved supportive.I suggest this approach because I did just that.I found myself in a hostle duty station,My division chief thought I would be a good fuck.He thought I was cute.Now I wasnt the smartest sailor that walked,but I wrote a letter to my CO and to the ships chaplin.Now you know why Norfolk VA got its reputation as (shit city) because the crap really hit the fan.To make a long story short,I got my transfer,and the captain and I became drinking buddies.I swear on my honor that this is a true story..rob
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Garrett
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Toe is in the water |
Registered: January 1970
Messages: 77
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Im not being abused right now, but I have the awful memories of being abused. It was never him either, it was someone else.
Someone long gone. But I still cant talk to anyone about it like a chaplain or psycologist.
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marc
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Needs to get a life! |
Registered: March 2003
Messages: 4729
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Garrett,
Many of us here know first hand of abuses. You can feel free to tell everything or nothing. No one here will think ill of you whichever you decide.
Life is great for me... Most of the time... But then I meet people online... Very few are real friends... Many say they are but know nothing of what it means... Some say they are, but are so shallow...
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Guest
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On fire! |
Registered: March 2012
Messages: 2344
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Well young man you seem to have touched all our hearts but it seems like you got a stubborn streak in you.you seem to want to wallow in self pity,not listing to some good advice.Your father is not stupid.he will figure you out and then it will be shit city.If what you describe is true,its only gonna get worse.AT THE VERY LEAST,START A JOURNAL! FIND A SECRET PLACE TO KEEP IT.wRITE DOWN YOUR FEELINGS AND THOUGHTS.Best of luck to you..r
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Garrett
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Toe is in the water |
Registered: January 1970
Messages: 77
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Im not stubborn and I am taking the advice of everyone. I answered a couple question. Im just trying to find out more.
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Stubborn is a GOOD thing for you...it proves you have some inner strength, even in this new environment with people you don't know, and many of us adults.
You're doing fine. Keep asking questions, as many as you need, and keep telling us which ones work for you and which ones don't work.
Cuz what works for one of the rest of us might not be good for you, and vice versa.
And Angel says you're already helping him and others, too?
All in your first week here.
Proud to know you!
"Always forgive your enemies...nothing annoys them quite so much." Oscar Wilde
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And I can tell you from personal experience that there are MANY gay people in the military and their families. I have met many of them.
You are not alone!
I know it's hard right now, but keep you eyes and your heart open and you just might find friends there to talk to.
Best wishes,
Kevin
"Be excellent to each other, and, party on dudes"!
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Garrett
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Toe is in the water |
Registered: January 1970
Messages: 77
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Thanx
All of you have answered so much, but I have so many more. Like why people have to make something of themselves in front of their peers. To do mean stuff not only to me but to everybody just to join some group or to stay in some group. It wrong.
Im just trying to help the people that helped me, thats all. I dont think im doing all much good but Im trying.
Thanx
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13796
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Talking seems so feeble.
I was nto abused, but still had a lot to talk through. As I talked I ofnd those who had been abused. They talked to me about their issues and I talked to them about mine.
Each set of issues eased. Sometimes for ever, sometimes for a while. but they eased.
Even the very awfulness of the acts done became a little easier each time it was spoken of.
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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smith
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On fire! |
Registered: January 1970
Messages: 1095
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For an abused child, everytime he can say it aloud or type it, it becomes easier. The first time is like reliving it, but after awhile, it becomes something that you can say and can get past. It actually can make the child a good person. At least that's what I've been told.
JJ
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trevor
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Really getting into it |
Registered: November 2002
Messages: 732
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I think we all want to be accepted and appreciated. Most of us need some positive, affirming outside opinion of ourselves. Heck, that's probably a big part of why many of us are on this board.
So, especially in school where you're pretty much forced to spend time with a group of people that doesn't change much over time, we do what we can to be popular - to make others want to hang out with us. Later in life, it's easier to choose your environment and peers.
Some people never really move past this to find true self-esteem, where their self-acceptance is more important than peer acceptance. I know adults who are incredibly cliquey. At my wife's 20-year class reunion, she was appalled and amazed to discover how many people were in the same cliques and saying the same things they did in HS. Admittedly (sadly) it wasn't a progressive town and many of then didn't attend college, which at least gives us a chance to be introduced to a new group, a new town, etc, and break the mold a bit.
In a way, this can be a generally good thing - it makes us follow the rules of society or suffer being outcast by society. Of course, especially when the "rules of society" are just plain wrong (e.g. bigotry, hazing, gangs) it's a problem.
Personally, I just really lucked out in HS because I really didn't care what others thought and wasn't part of any definable group, I was a geek and in the drama club, yet somehow I was respected by almost everyone. My mom hand made my shirts and jeans, that's HOW geeky I was. Maybe it helped that my older brother was popular and a jock and on ASB etc etc - I dunno. Frankly, I think I was mostly just oblivious.
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Garrett
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Toe is in the water |
Registered: January 1970
Messages: 77
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But because thats happened to me, I feel like an awful, dirty, messed up person. I just feel nasty, it was so ewwwww. I feel grody, but admiting it to all of you is getting easier. I still could never tell someone here though, someone connected to my family and especially my father.
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or don't realize the harm they cause because they are trying to make everything fit into their own idea of what is acceptable or popular. This is called verbal abuse. What they are trying to do is live outside the truth, and make everyone else believe the lie. To combat verbal abuse you need to have a belief in your own feelings and know that you do not fit the image they are trying to fit you into. Communicate back to them that you do not accept their attempt to portray you as something other than what you truly are.
Hugs, Charlie
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marc
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Needs to get a life! |
Registered: March 2003
Messages: 4729
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I know how hard it can be to say the words, even to just type them on a computer.
A huge hurt seems to weigh less when it is shared with people that care.
I know......
Life is great for me... Most of the time... But then I meet people online... Very few are real friends... Many say they are but know nothing of what it means... Some say they are, but are so shallow...
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not something that you caused or even allowed to happen. You were not in a position to change what happened because that person was controlling you through whatever actions he (or she) perpetrated upon you. Yes, you feel dirty now, and disgusted with what you were subjected to, but do not ever feel that it's your fault it happened.
You do need to talk to someone who has been trained in dealing with these types of matters. I know that is a very, very difficult step to take because it requires you publicly stating (at least to authorities) what was done to you, but the sooner you get professional help then the better you will feel about yourself. This board can never replace competent, professional guidance.
Hugs, Charlie
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Garrett
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Toe is in the water |
Registered: January 1970
Messages: 77
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Thanx
But I still dont see why people have to hate or act like they hate people who are the slightest bit different or even arent around them very often. Like everybody in my school doesnt know anything about me. They have no clue who I am or what Im like, so how does that give them the right to say stuff about me? It doesnt, but they still do. Why? The only good thing about it is that its only half the school. Most of the girls dont even talk to me or about me, and the ones that do think Im cute. Thats a problem because of the whole gay thing. So what do I do?
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Garrett
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Toe is in the water |
Registered: January 1970
Messages: 77
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I know that it wasnt my fault but I still feel disgusting. I have tried to talk to psycologists, but I know that others would have found out. I just dont trust them. My father payed for it so they would have told him, I know they would have. The time that I trust someone with confidentiality to tell it to their face will be when Im an adult and on my own. Till then I cant. But I am having the worst time trying to keep it a secret from all of these people around me.
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trevor
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Really getting into it |
Registered: November 2002
Messages: 732
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Maybe a first step would be to put the feelings in a journal? At least that would get them out, a bit. Maybe later, if and when you trust someone here a bit, you can share, but only because you want to and to "get it out" a bit more. Several people here have similar personal experience.
I am sure this is no easy thing to do. But, it certainly doesn't make you a freak. My mother, both sisters, and nephew were all sexually abused. I read that something like up to 50% of females in the US are either abused or coerced. They say abuse of males many not be much lower, but isn't reported often enough for good stats. Part of the problem with sexual abuse, unlike other forms of abuse, is it's not only extremely personal, but sometimes the victims body reacts and he or she is somewhat aroused. That further leads to guilt, when of course there should be none - nobody "asks" to be abused.
But, like Charlie said, we are no substitute for professional counseling. I thought all counselors (US, anyway) were sworn to confidentiality such that they CAN'T discuss what a patient tells them, even with the parent who's paying the bill? I'm sure it happens sometimes, but you are old enough to know and raise a stink - can't they lose their license to practice or something?
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Garrett
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Toe is in the water |
Registered: January 1970
Messages: 77
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Im so worried that someone will find the journal if I have one, but I am thinking of writing my life story. It will be hard but its something I think will help me.
Psycologists are way out of the picture now. My father has no clue that I have such feelings so he doesnt think that I should see one. Plus they always seem to have no emotions or feelings, they just seem like they dont care. Theyve seen hundreds of people with problms like mine, so they just dont care. Plus Im sure that if they knew I needed help, they would say something. Because if they tell for a good enough reason or somehing, then nothing will happen to them.
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Guest
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On fire! |
Registered: March 2012
Messages: 2344
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you sure seem to like swimming in that toilet you have created for yourself.The more I read of your posts,the more I am sure that you NEED someone to set a match under your butt.It seems all posts are feel sorry for poor little me.At the risk of pissing off others on this board,Start following some of the good advice given-get off your ass and take some control of your life.Make yourself-then us proud.We care!!!!!!! rob
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trevor
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Really getting into it |
Registered: November 2002
Messages: 732
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Hmm - I think Robert's point HOWEVER DREADFULLY STATED is that you need to look for possibilities and opportunites rather than focusing on the "I can't because . . . " I know - I do that too, and I know it's not easy to be positive. (To be painfully honest, I started antidepressant meds last week, myself. Sorry, too early for a status report.)
But, here's an easy one - you seem to have some computer privacy to send e-mails and post here, so use the word processor with a password-protected document. Or, send yourself journal entries as e-mails (so it's not even on the computer) or set up a message board on voy.com (takes about an hour if you've never done it before) so you can write to your hearts content in a format that supports a journal very well. There are thousands of them, so if you leave out the specific personal info, no one will ever find it, but, if and when you want, you can easily give the URL to someone you want to share it with. I think you can even password protect it altogether. It's free and easy.
You're a smart guy - an online journal that's confidential should be an easy deal - improve your typing speed, too!
Regarding the counselor - I have seen one and had both my kids see different ones off and on. They all need to act professional - they can't cry just because you do - but, by the nature of the job, most do really care about people, and most are compassionate and value your privacy. Unless you are hurting someone - including yourself - or planning to, they have no justification to tell anyone else to "help" you - they ARE the help. Unless I'm missing something?
If you want to, drop David in HK (above, this thread) a line - he is a professional counselor himself. Ask him questions. Send him a nude photo. [No, no, just kidding - wanted to see if you are paying attention. Hope you grinned, at least.]
I think there are some online services, but I don't know how effective they are. I don't "normally" refer people elsewhere, especially in "public" but I don't think he would mind: Stop by Ashley's message board - there is an online counseling service "ad" if you scroll down a ways: http://www.voy.com/12550/ I think he checked it out and commented, but I haven't. I'm sure it's not as good as an in-person office visit, though.
I'm sorry Ashley is offline for awhile, because I think you share some common history. But, maybe a look there will show you how he has found some great I-friends to share his pain with a little, at least. If you post there and ask for a reply, you may just hear from his dad, who probably knows too well what you have been through and feel. I don't know his dad that well, but he may have some ideas, too.
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Guest
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On fire! |
Registered: March 2012
Messages: 2344
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much thanks trev you have made my day and given me a new nicname.You can be sure that I will wear that with pride.BTW my precious sweetheart,my second cyber hero, since when is it poor taste to get really pissed and (tell it the way it is).hehehe Now I could be mistaken,and feel free to jump all over my ass for what I am about to say,And please dont take this the wrong way,but this kid seems a little too good to be true.I smell a rat!I could be wrong,but in my life-walk I have NEVER witnessed a youth so disfunctional or in so much denial.I am very much concerned that this person has seemed to attach to the younger set on our board.Perhaps my suspicions are unfounded and I hope they are,But I urge caution.THIS POST IS NOT MENT AS A FLAME!!! rob.
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13796
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Do it when you have learnt to trust.
I suggest you start with someone chosen at random. You will, or course, NOT reveal any personal details about who you are.
By the way, confidentiality is absolute whever pays when dealing with a psychologist, BUT you probably don't need "paid for help". At least not now you've started to be able to speak.
This thread is likely to get bounced by software to page 2 soon, btw. Nothing to do with you. It "happens". No-one much looks at page 2, so you'll need a new thread.
You may be afraid that speaking of the details will allow someone else to "get off" on what was done to you. 99.9999999% unlikely to happen. Just talk, quietly, by email or by instant message service to someone you choose to trust. recognise that you will weep hot tears, and that is normal.
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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I've been through that exact thing back in my school days. I knew very few people but apparantly much of the rest of the school knew I was a total idiot. I know how frustrating that is, and there's not much you can do about it other than talking to your parents and talking to the school faculty, make them aware of what they should already know really; that bullying is taking place in the school.
You MUST talk to someone, there's no other way around this. The only other choice is to just try and tough it out and believe you me when I say that is not a pleasant option (I had 12 years of unpleasantness being heaped upon me in liberal doses, and it took a heavy toll on me). You still have many years of school left, they can be good years if you let them...
It takes courage, yes. But you can do it, I know you can.
-L
"But he that hath the steerage of my course,
direct my sail."
-William Shakespeare, Romeo and Juliet, Act One, Scene IV
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13796
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He's started. The first step was hard to do, and he's here.
What he needs most now is to feel safe. Now I know your message is a goood one, and is a safe one. It;s just kind of hard to follow all at once.
This is a step at a time process, sometimes with the paces going in circles, or backwards.
Sometimes a memory triggers overwhelming guilt (normal and illogical), or serious grief, or brings back another bigger memory. This all takes time and effort and is a reallty gentle process
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13796
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It doesn't actually matter at all if anyone posts the absolute truth here or if it is different from reality. What matters instead is that someone can come here without fear of being disbelieved, without the fear of ridicule, and without being turned away.
Each of us has our own personal circumstances. Some of those are truly unbelievable, and are none the less true for all that.
This young man is starting to pour his heart out. Allow him to without criticism. He needs to be able to talk.
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13796
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Any advice should be from the perspective of the person asking, not the person giving!
So much is here. help, advice, deep discussions, freedom to do anything except judge, insult anyone or flame them.
So, please please keep within that set of parameters
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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Guest
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On fire! |
Registered: March 2012
Messages: 2344
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you are absolutely right Timmy. rob
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Re: I NEED ANSWERS!!!!!!! 
Re: Hey 
We all need answers, Garrett 
Re: keep comming back 
Re: keep comming back 
Re: keep comming back 
Re: It does help to talk about things........ 
Re: Please don't do that 
