|
|
tim
|
 |
Really getting into it |
Location: UK, West of London in Ber...
Registered: February 2002
Messages: 842
|
|
|
Out of respect for the thread you are using as your playground, I am replying here.
I refuse to accept that anything is dark enough about you to make me walk away from you. I wil not put words in anyone else's mouth, nor ask them to "sign up below" if the agree with me, for it is not as simple as one believes to say "I accept you unconditionally." Others here: if you truly believe that you can commit to unconditional acceptance of Lenny's issues, Do indicate so. It is NO shame not to do so. It is a tough thing to make a true commitment "sight unseen". If you do indicate to him that you can and will do this, please understand that "commitment" means "doing the thing that you said you would do, even when the mood you said it in has left you". He may tell us things that are dark to us as well as dark to him.
Lenny, if you choose either here or by email to contact me directly, I will listen. I'll make you a promise that I will not desert you, even if you manage to shock me. Gradually you may choose to reveal either in private or in public, the things that trouble you the most.
I doubt you are 100% alone in whatever troubles you. Sometimes simply talking allows the big things to become manageable.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
brian
|
 |
Toe is in the water |
Registered: January 1970
Messages: 60
|
|
|
Tim, your post sounds mysterious.
somehow I have some sort of feeling what Lenny's troubles could be about but I honestly want to refuse to read anything into something.
Lenny, I can only quote Tim here: "I refuse to accept that anything is dark enough about you to make me walk away from you." I might be young but in my time on this earth (now that does sound strange) there have been a lot of things I have heard and seen. Nothing has made me turn away from somebody yet except for the lately unfortunately frequent case that somebody has been lying to me. When I decide to commit myself to a person (the way Tim has formulated it above) then I expect honesty.
Two years ago I wouldn't have believed that I could be friends with people with whom I am friends now. I doubted I would be able to accept them, but my experience has shown me, that I am capable of doing so, and right now I know nothing that could make me turn my back on you. And believe me, my fantasy can run wild 
Love,
Brian
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
tim
|
|
Really getting into it |
Location: UK, West of London in Ber...
Registered: February 2002
Messages: 842
|
|
|
More like careful.
I have no idea what Lenny's issues are. I simply know that some people are and others are not "up to the task" of commiting to accept someoen unconditionally.
It's hard when one suffers alone. For so many years I felt i was the only queer teenager. You, Brian have other issues to face which some people woudl consider unusual and otehrs normal. Lenny's may be as complex as yours, or genuinely simple. Yet to him, and this is the important thing, to him they are all consuming.
So I sought to reassure. And achieved being mysterious. Ah me! Such is life
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
All of us here have our own stories, or we wouldn't be here. Nor would we willingly turn our backs to another seeking advice or just wanting a shoulder to cry on. I have found that in talking to others and sharing the burden truly does make the weight of the world lighter. Even in the darkest a light can be found.
Hugs, Charlie
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Go for it, Lenny. Either here on the MB or to whomever you choose individually by email. No problem either way.
Walt Whitman said "I am large. I contain multitudes." Now, personally, I say that just about my weight...hehehe
But it's a good way to think about the vast myriad strands of human experience.
Go ahead! Shock us! We're ready for you, and you have our curiosity peeked! Or is that peaked?
"Always forgive your enemies...nothing annoys them quite so much." Oscar Wilde
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Your support is very much appreciated.
Again, thank you so much.
-Lenny
"But he that hath the steerage of my course,
direct my sail."
-William Shakespeare, Romeo and Juliet, Act One, Scene IV
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
tim
|
|
Really getting into it |
Location: UK, West of London in Ber...
Registered: February 2002
Messages: 842
|
|
|
No Message Body
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
trevor
|
|
Really getting into it |
Registered: November 2002
Messages: 732
|
|
|
No Message Body
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
trevor
|
|
Really getting into it |
Registered: November 2002
Messages: 732
|
|
|
No Message Body
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
tim
|
|
Really getting into it |
Location: UK, West of London in Ber...
Registered: February 2002
Messages: 842
|
|
|
I will not tell you "Lenny, you are wanted". I will tell you instead that I like you.
I will not wish you a happy birthday. Instead I will wish that you stay here long enough to meet your needs and that I hope we can, one of us or al of us, help you to discover peace of mind.
I will tell you, though, that, in my own way, I understand the neglect, perhaps more, that you have suffered. We have a little of that in common, you and I, though the overlap is not large.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Steve
|
|
Really getting into it |
Location: London, England
Registered: November 2006
Messages: 465
|
|
|
Lenny, things cannot be as bad as they seem. Try to break out of the blackness that you have in your soul and into the light. Today is your birthday: go out and enjoy yourself - see a movie or something, even if you do it alone. If you tell us where we can find you maybe one of us lives near enough to meet up with you to try to take you out of yourself. At any rate, I am going to humour myself and wish you a happier birthday than you wish yourself.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
tim
|
|
Really getting into it |
Location: UK, West of London in Ber...
Registered: February 2002
Messages: 842
|
|
|
Or I think I do
I see other people's lack of understanding expressd as rage or horror.
But I also see two boys like I wanted to be, with each other to rely on, with the knowledge tjhat love exisist though the world is a cruel place.
So much symbolism in that video, even down to the water rushing through the empty eye sockets, but so much tenderness and love, too.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
trevor
|
|
Really getting into it |
Registered: November 2002
Messages: 732
|
|
|
Consumerism. Some people never do realize what you have realized - things are just things. I've been up and down financially and also lived with people in true poverty, who are even more materialistic. Being unemployed and spending all the time I want with my kids lately has truely been a blessing. The need for toys is practically gone. I'm typing this on a Pentium (I) 133, I believe!
Sometimes I think we all hate parts of ourselves, but the Lenny I've seen here so far is a beautiful, caring, thoughtful person. I can imagine some nasty things - there's darkness in my soul, too - but nothing that could shadow that little bit of beauty I've seen so far. Tim started this thread with "unconditional acceptance." Yes, I agree. Being blessed with children, I think I understand "unconditional love" too, a bit, which I believe is what God has for us, as our perfect Father.
I see the end of the video as a future we can still change. Elsewhere, a young person asked why bother trying to stop people from using "gay" to mean "stupid idiot," which I've also seen firsthand in my children. It will probably take generations and lots of suffering and lots of love on the part of those who cannot understand - the "in spite of", unconditional kind - agape? - but someday I want my descendants to feel free to express their joy to their lovers after a great match, regardless of who they love.
Thanks for baring a bit of your soul, Lenny, and get us thinking about ourselves as well.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
tim
|
|
Really getting into it |
Location: UK, West of London in Ber...
Registered: February 2002
Messages: 842
|
|
|
I have a son who is gay friendly. He teases me like mad. I asked him, "Why do you say 'that is SO gay' at times?" He had no idea, and offered to stop doing it.
Frankly I can say that it no longer offends me. I genuinely do not mind the word "gay" (which perplexes me anyway) being used in a mildly disparaging manner. I can laiugfh at myself, and yes at the incongruity of gay male sexual acts, which are ludicrous, and yes highly desirable too!
I prefer it to "homo", or "Queer!" or "poof" or "Nancy boy" or "faggot" (why 'faggot'? A bundle of sticks? A Bassoon?).
I don't mind mild and gentle abuse at all. We will never stop it.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
trevor
|
|
Really getting into it |
Registered: November 2002
Messages: 732
|
|
|
Yes, that's sort of an inside joke, between friends who trust each other and intend no harm. I get that a bit with my wife, who asked me which Olympic skater was the cutest the other day, and it brings us together a bit in a way - a shared secret, I suppose.
When I was in high school, the "hated" kids were called "faggot" sometimes. But the kids now, and much younger, are calling each other "gay" as a negative, general, hateful name, and frequently. Many don't even know what a homosexual is. Unfortunately, it's also the most "politcally correct" label we've got.
So, I worry that actual gay kids will feel a negativity that affects their/our self-image if not their general safety. I don't like "gay" being synonymous with "stupid" or some other negative concept. I suppose it's probably what my sister, who is mulatto (sp? half-black) and "passes" for caucasion, feels when people call each other nigger around her. Doesn't exactly give her the warm fuzzies.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
trevor
|
|
Really getting into it |
Registered: November 2002
Messages: 732
|
|
|
I hope you find sleep, a little refuge. Know that we're thinking of you, at least, and you're making an impact on us.
I so wish there was more I could do.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
tim
|
|
Really getting into it |
Location: UK, West of London in Ber...
Registered: February 2002
Messages: 842
|
|
|
I think we need to develop, and teach the development of, the ability to smile and laugh at ourselves.
We are, in so many ways, less different form your fellows than a racial background. We simply are somehow pre-programmed to desire a member fo the same gender as our emotional and physical partner. Looked at from a couple fo paces way this IS ridiculous, and is laughable.
Of course it doesn't feel that way inside the mess.
I found that by emphasisiing that "gay" should not be used as an insult it became used more. The fashion will surely pass.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
tim
|
|
Really getting into it |
Location: UK, West of London in Ber...
Registered: February 2002
Messages: 842
|
|
|
Different dark.
At the end of your messages the same time and date appears. For a while it seemd like a slip of the "pen", but it has a purpose. Will you tell me, or us, that purpose?
I thought of dying once. More recently I stopped thinking of living. Sometoimes I still do. But I am determined to see what life has in store for me, and refuse to change this by my own purposeful hand.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
One thing that bisexuals can be thankful for...
They don't have to worry about that term being hurled at them on the playground!
"That's soooo bisexual, dude..."
LOL
"Always forgive your enemies...nothing annoys them quite so much." Oscar Wilde
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Yes, I read your post. Seems to have been an ill-fated night yesterday.
The time and date at the bottom of the message is when I finished that particular 'thorny piece'. Several of the first ones came out in a fairly short time period so the dates aren't that far apart. I wrote another one yesterday I think, and chances are you'll get to see it eventually...
I select one that I think will fit the mood of my current post, I don't pick them in chronological order.
-Lenny
PS: Trevor... Thanks. It's nice of you to think of me.
"But he that hath the steerage of my course,
direct my sail."
-William Shakespeare, Romeo and Juliet, Act One, Scene IV
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
tim
|
|
Really getting into it |
Location: UK, West of London in Ber...
Registered: February 2002
Messages: 842
|
|
|
Lenny is your name, yet not the name you have been given.
Is it the name you have chosen, or the name that you feel expresses most about you, or the name that somehow arrived and suits you?
The "Lenny" of my childhood was a lion, and was brave, and also a child-like lion. I wonder how much or how little of this is you?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Lenny is not my "official" name, but it means more to me than my "real" name. I have picked it for myself, and I feel good about it. I never liked my real name, ever. It has always been a thing of ugliness in my eyes.
I might actually go ahead and change it proper, but it is a big step. Then I'd have to go and explain it to everyone, answer their questions of how and why, and I'm not sure I want to do that. For now, I prefer to just have it like this.
-Lenny
"But he that hath the steerage of my course,
direct my sail."
-William Shakespeare, Romeo and Juliet, Act One, Scene IV
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
tim
|
|
Really getting into it |
Location: UK, West of London in Ber...
Registered: February 2002
Messages: 842
|
|
|
I wonder if you know what I mean.
It is the lion, to me. A creature of power and gentleness. This particular lion anyway. To me this is a good thing. It makes me think of you and smile gently inside.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
It is kind of a double-faced coin you're presenting here. On one side, the image of the gentle lion you speak of.
Then, on the other there is the lion male that kill rival males' cubs when he takes over a harem of females...
I can relate to both sides, at different times.
But I appreciate the gesture, I think I know what you meant. It's just that I am as divided as the coin I just spoke of. Sorry, I know you were only trying to be friendly, and all I come with in return is doom and gloom...
-Lenny
"But he that hath the steerage of my course,
direct my sail."
-William Shakespeare, Romeo and Juliet, Act One, Scene IV
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
tim
|
|
Really getting into it |
Location: UK, West of London in Ber...
Registered: February 2002
Messages: 842
|
|
|
Both interpretations are fine. But cling to the one you attribute to me when times get tough, not the one you discvered with cubs and harems.
I have a feeling the image of the lion killing the cubs is not totally the case, though.
Be more gentle on yourself. Just for a day or two. Try it out for size. If you dislike it you can discard it
|
|
|
|
|
Goto Forum:
|
] 
A Place of Safety
Search
Help
Register
Login
Home
Mysterious? No 
I heartily endorse Tim's words. 
Lenny, I wish I was there to hug you. 
We all have the right to interpret things differently :) 
