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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hir
It's the exact same text, dunno who's copied off who, but less "fluff" surrounding the actual contents. 
Wikipedia is an awesome resource by the way, one can lose HOURS following one link to the next.
Thanks for raising the subject btw, it was very interesting!
Hugs:
-L
"But he that hath the steerage of my course,
direct my sail."
-William Shakespeare, Romeo and Juliet, Act One, Scene IV
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saben
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On fire! |
Registered: May 2003
Messages: 1537
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English is language made by adopting ideas from other languages, being primarily derived from Germanic languages and Latin languages (French, especially). Randomly constructing new words without any seeming explanation or etymological roots behind them doesn't overly sit with me too well. I am sure that there is a possible, etymologically correct solution.
From what I am reading at http://www.merriam-webster.com 'he' and 'she' have the same etymology anyway:
Main Entry: he
Pronunciation: 'hE, E
Function: pronoun
Etymology: Middle English, from Old English hE; akin to Old English hEo she, hit it, Old High German hE he, Latin cis, citra on this side, Greek ekeinos that person
Main Entry: she
Pronunciation: 'shE
Function: pronoun
Etymology: Middle English, probably alteration of hye, alteration of Old English hEo she -- more at HE
That seems to reflect to me that at some stage in the English language, the third person pronoun was gender inspecific but that somewhere in the Dark Ages they were so "enlightened" as to start using new words for females, although quite possible 'her' is the original English third person pronoun, because 'his' has no listed etymology, whereas 'her' is as follows:
Main Entry: her
Pronunciation: (h)&r, 'h&r
Function: adjective
Etymology: Middle English hire, from Old English hiere, genitive of hEo she -- more at HE
So what do I think would be a good solution? Simply use 'he' as a generic pronoun, with 'her' and 'herself' used as the object, posessive and reflexive forms. Some feministic groups would probably get upset about this appeared masculinisation of the language, but I think it is the most appropriate solution to compromise between any seeming gender biased, in addition to staying true to the foundation upon which the English language is based.
Alternatively we could stick to the currently used convention of 'they' although when a person's gender is "known" this seems to have an awkward feel to it. It also seems that this could more easily be confused with the plural third person pronoun of the same name.
Running through a list of other suggested alternatives with my thoughts on them:
'E', 'em' and 'eir' just sounds like badly pronounced English.
'Sie' and 'hir' have a slightly female bias and are too similar to 'see' and 'here'.
'Ze' and 'zir' are just random and few words in English are pronounced with that starting 'z' sound as 'tz'.
So in closing, I guess it is impossible to come up with an alternative that pleases everyone and indeed any artificial word would struggle to be adopted. But if a person finds herself in a situation where he is able to sucessfully use these words without confusing people or conjuring a gender specific image, then more power to her.
Look at this tree. I cannot make it blossom when it suits me nor make it bear fruit before its time [...] No matter what you do, that seed will grow to be a peach tree. You may wish for an apple or an orange, but you will get a peach.
Master Oogway
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sparks
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Toe is in the water |
Registered: January 1970
Messages: 57
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language is common sense communication between peoples.so what if the english is a bit confusing.There are better things to worry about .a very plesent day to all. sparks
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i will wander around this site tonight, i think!
my void does not want.
-- 2.13.61.
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ahahaha, your very last paragraph made me blink about 405835 times.
originally, i started to google these pronouns because as per this trans mailing list i joined (though never, ever talk on--they are ALL either in chicago or san fran, all know each other, and so yeah, awkward), they use zir and zi and so on an awful lot. so i was kind of like, 'hmmm..' since it came up on this message board.
another message board i've been on, mostly for ED recovery based reasons, well. they (majority) refuse to even call me leander; some have even come right out and said: 'i'm sorry, i just can't, i've met you as heathyr and can't see you as any other way.' and let me tell you, it's very hard to 'recover' in an environment that can't accept a big part of who you are, yet accepts other NON-ED aspects of OTHER people's lives in stride.
it stings a lot because ... where else do i have to go? sure, i've come back to posting here but a lot of the bridges i damaged still aren't mended no matter how hard i try. it was always "APOS for these things" and "broken for THESE things" and now it's kind of like ... "okay i will avoid both things and go play on neopets.com for nine hours." 
my void does not want.
-- 2.13.61.
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sparks
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Toe is in the water |
Registered: January 1970
Messages: 57
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I absolutely hate it when a person calls themselves NOTHING..Damn it YOU ARE SOMETHING,someone that is very important at least to me.I cannot understand why some choose to diminish the life-force that is ours to share.I was litterly gobsmacked when I say the number of views on one topic below.over 500 views.DArt is a hero in my books.The life-force that that man shares is truely awesome.Expressed in writing and real life.What a fantastic site this is.Truely amazing. sparks
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i'm confused ... what does my user name have to do with 500 views on a post of d'arts? or did i just read you wrong? if i have, please explain.
as far as referring to myself as nothing goes, you'd probably have to root out older posts of mine. there is a valid reason i "diminish" myself; my life force is short-spanned at best, and isn't really ... all that great? i don't know. diminishing myself doesn't bother me; maybe because i'm that diminished by now.
anyway, sorry? i hope i'm not causing a problem. god knows i've done enough of that around here and have hardly any 'homes' left to escape to.
my void does not want.
-- 2.13.61.
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sparks
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Toe is in the water |
Registered: January 1970
Messages: 57
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I try to limit my posts here.When I replied to your post and finished my comment,I thought about adding a nice add to DArt.Please do not take offense as I try to make my comments positive.However I do wish you would not diminish yourself. sparks
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i didn't know it was a 2-in-1! sorry about the confusion!
my void does not want.
-- 2.13.61.
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sparks
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Toe is in the water |
Registered: January 1970
Messages: 57
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aha.now i know why i mentioned DArt.What a fantastic guy.With respect I suggest you draw on some of that mans power.Awesome sparks
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..because only girls can't interpret confusing posts? no guys have gotten turnt around by confusing posts around here?
whatever.
man, if i had a million dollars right now i'd jump on the T and get every surgery possible in transition.
i am NOT a girl, thank you VERY $%R*&$#) much.
my void does not want.
-- 2.13.61.
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sparks
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Toe is in the water |
Registered: January 1970
Messages: 57
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please forgive my rather crude joke as it was only ment in fun and i am sorry if i made you angry. sparks
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Re:sounds like sour grapes guys hehehe 
Re:very respectful comment 
