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Just a few days before Jerusalem's Pride Parade is due to march the mayor banned the march. The organizers of the Parade to him to court. The court ruled not only that the parade must go ahead but also fined the mayor personally a substantial sum (court costs). You can read about it here:
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/592439.html
The paradox has often been noted that the United States, founded in secularism, is now the most religiose country in Christendom, while England, with an established church headed by its constitutional monarch, is among the least. (Richard Dawkins, 2006)
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marc
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Needs to get a life! |
Registered: March 2003
Messages: 4729
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$6100.oo + in court costs....... HOLY JESUS...... thats alot of cost for so little court.
OOPS...... sorry
HOLY MOSES.....
Life is great for me... Most of the time... But then I meet people online... Very few are real friends... Many say they are but know nothing of what it means... Some say they are, but are so shallow...
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13796
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Justice is always a nice thing to see done 
Would that work in Tampa?
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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marc
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Needs to get a life! |
Registered: March 2003
Messages: 4729
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Whats in Tampa?
Life is great for me... Most of the time... But then I meet people online... Very few are real friends... Many say they are but know nothing of what it means... Some say they are, but are so shallow...
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13796
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It appears that the Pride parade there has been banned. And at least one church is rejoicing that there are no ho-mo-sex-shules in theor county, which is blessedly "clean"
Seems to be that Gay Power needs to rise there, rather like Black Power.
I do wonder what a "Gay Panther" might look like, though. But serio=usly it looks as though the Gay Liberation Front needs to rise again
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13796
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Would you mind if I asked you to clarify that? I read it two ways. It may soiund dumb, but as a reader I cannot work out of you are approving of the court sentence and fine or disapproving.
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13796
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I regret I cannot yet find chapter and verse to back this up? Mayeb we have a Floridan who can help?
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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marc
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Needs to get a life! |
Registered: March 2003
Messages: 4729
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Google it up with "gay tampa"
Life is great for me... Most of the time... But then I meet people online... Very few are real friends... Many say they are but know nothing of what it means... Some say they are, but are so shallow...
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13796
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Pride And Trepidation
By JULIE PACE jpace@tampatrib.com
Published: Jun 27, 2005
advertisement
TAMPA - Sandra Dowell, a lifelong resident of Hillsborough County, said she doesn't feel welcome here anymore, now that county commissioners have refused to support gay pride events.
Dowell and her partner of two years, Diane Bower, plan to move out of the county, probably to St. Petersburg.
``It's freer over there,'' Dowell said. ``But I'm having to leave my hometown.''
Dowell and Bower were among more than 5,000 people who gathered in downtown Tampa Sunday for a Pride is Back march and rally. Marchers demanded the repeal of the county commission's recent decision not to acknowledge, promote or participate in gay pride events.
Sunday's march in Tampa coincided with gay pride parades in San Francisco, New York, Chicago and other cities. The annual parades commemorate the Stonewall uprising of 1969, a series of clashes between gays and police in New York City widely considered the beginning of the gay rights movement.
The crowd in Tampa gathered outside John F. Germany Public Library at 3 p.m., where two gay literature displays were taken down after the commission's July 15 vote. That decision followed the earlier removal of a similar display at the West Gate Regional Library.
Brian Winfield of Equality Florida, the lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender human rights group that organized Sunday's rally, said the initial removal of the library display was shocking.
``It felt like a story from 50 years ago,'' Winfield said.
What came next was even more appalling to Winfield. He called the commission's decision reckless because it left ambiguity over how the policy would be enforced.
``It was so vague because none of the county agencies have any idea how it applies to them,'' Winfield said.
Much of the marchers' anger was directed at Commissioner Ronda Storms, who proposed the policy change.
``What right does she have to speak for all?'' Bower said.
Bower held her girlfriend's hand and gestured to the crowd gathered outside the library.
``We are part of the all,'' she said.
Marchers represented a diverse cross-section of the Bay area community, as straight parents and their children joined gay and lesbian couples, students and senior citizens.
Seventy-three-year-old Nancy Combs came to the rally from New Port Richey with her husband. Combs marched and carried a sign that read ``Straight, Not Narrow'' in support of her gay friends.
``When people push them back, we'll stand behind them,'' Combs said.
Only one man came out in opposition to the pride rally and march. While the Equality Florida organizers did not have a permit to march, 10 Tampa police officers, several of whom are gay or lesbian, volunteered to cordon off the downtown streets and direct traffic as marchers filled Zack and Morgan streets. Marchers walked from the library to the county commission building.
Maj. Jane Castor, the police department's liaison with the gay and lesbian community, said she wasn't surprised by her officers' response.
``Tampa police support all the residents of the city,'' Castor said.
The department said there were no reports of incidents during the parade.
Commissioner Kathy Castor - the only commissioner to vote against Storm's proposal - said the large crowd at the march showed the high level of support for the gay and lesbian community in the county.
``I don't think the commission's vote represents this very tolerant and inclusive community,'' Castor said.
The other six county commissioners did not respond to telephone calls. In the past, the commissioners who voted for Storm's proposal have said it is inappropriate for the county to promote gay pride.
``You can respect somebody's human dignity and treat them with courtesy, but I'm still not going to promote what you do,'' Storms said last week.
Among the marchers was at least one who wanted to thank the commissioners who voted against supporting gay pride.
``The best thing that ever happened to us was Ronda Storms,'' a man who identified himself as R. Zeke Fread said as he waved a rainbow flag. ``She got us all together.''
Information from the Associated Press was used in this report. Reporter Julie Pace can be reached at (813) 865-1505.
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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marc
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Needs to get a life! |
Registered: March 2003
Messages: 4729
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What is so important about PRIDE organizations?
What about the parades?
I personally believe it is by far more important to be active throughout the year. To dress down to as little as posible and sit on the flatbed of a truck garlaned and festooned with rainbow flags and spangles does little to promote the gay cause. What it does do is reinforct the notion that we as a social group do little other than flaunt our sexuality by being as outrageous a public spectacle as possible.
Who realy benefits from pride parades? Do youth somehow resolve their sexuality issues by seeing a leather bar float or a contingent of dykes on bikes?
Now admittedly there are legitimate groups represented, PFLAG, HRC to name a few, but can their message be heard through the clamor of amplified music blaring from floats full of drag queens?
Pride is a good thing to have, better to show and yet moreso to live as a matter of course. But the bitter pill of gay pride might go down a little easier concerning the general public if it was carried with a little more dignity.
Life is great for me... Most of the time... But then I meet people online... Very few are real friends... Many say they are but know nothing of what it means... Some say they are, but are so shallow...
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13796
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a parade is as useful as any parade. It says whatever the parade topic says
You are right abiout continual affirmation and action
Some people want a rallying point though. That is the purpose of a parade.
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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Marc wrote:
> What is so important about PRIDE organizations?
>
I think the answer to this will be different for each of us. If, for you, the answer is 'nothing', attendance is not compulsory.
For myself:
I'm pretty much at the conventional end of the gay spectrum in many ways. Although I've been fully out for all my working life (and happy to joke about boyfriends at work), I have a pretty conventional job, wear a suit-and-tie at work (501's & Tshirt out of work), am monogamous by nature, totally non-scene ... and my idea of a fun evening is a relaxing meal with close friends.
I'm active on a range of diversity and inclusiveness issues (not limited to gay politics). Yes, I think you could say that *for me* most of the time it works to carry forward the gay cause with dignity.
BUT I acknowledge my debt to those who take a different approach. To the screaming queens of Stonewall - and it was the fairies, flamers and sluts that stood up and fought. To the assorted punks and hustlers, immortalised in the works of (eg) Kenneth Anger and Robert Mapplethorpe, who gave us icons of an identity that was very male, but defiantly not heterosexual.
I would not be able to lead a relatively unmolested life of quiet dignity most of the time without the willingness of these forebears to put just about everything on the line for their right to BE what they felt they WERE.
So every few years I march on Pride - I worked on it for several years in the early 80's. For me it shows my recognition that I owe a great debt of gratitude to other men from all across the spectrum of those who self-identify as gay. It demonstrates that as a gay man I will not only demand that other people respect my own choices, but that I acknowledge, respect, and can work with those whose choices have been very different. It expresses my belief that we - the gay community (whatever that is!) - can and should set an example of acceptance of diversity.
And - sometimes - it's fun!
But everyone is different, and I know that Pride marches aren't to everyone's taste.
"The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral, begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy. ... Returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night devoid of stars." Martin Luther King
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marc
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Needs to get a life! |
Registered: March 2003
Messages: 4729
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Nothing??? Oh my no.... never nothing....
How did my post and question imply that PRIDE organizations are not important?
I have been activly involved with gay culture since my early teens.
I have been involved with the stonewall society since 1970.
I know about putting everything on the line and I know the consequences of the wrath of our society toward us.
I buried my partner due to an act of intolerance.
I've paid my fair share of dues.
Where I see the parades going over the line for the most part is when they tend to be more of a competition of outrageousness rather than the social statement they were in the begining.
Life is great for me... Most of the time... But then I meet people online... Very few are real friends... Many say they are but know nothing of what it means... Some say they are, but are so shallow...
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marc
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Needs to get a life! |
Registered: March 2003
Messages: 4729
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When people attend what do they see?
A social action promoting a cause......
or......
A group of over the top people doing their utmost to shock the viewers....
I know the logical answer is that they see both.....
But what will the departing spectator remember?
After all it's the memory of the event that causes the effect to take seed.
Life is great for me... Most of the time... But then I meet people online... Very few are real friends... Many say they are but know nothing of what it means... Some say they are, but are so shallow...
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Marc, I too would appreciate a clarification of your comment, if it's not too much trouble. Thanks.
The paradox has often been noted that the United States, founded in secularism, is now the most religiose country in Christendom, while England, with an established church headed by its constitutional monarch, is among the least. (Richard Dawkins, 2006)
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13796
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Possibly the parades themselves take their cues from the odd traditions(!) of carnivals, where garish dress and oddly decorated road haulage are the order of the day.
Consider for a moment the non gay pride carnival: It has scantily clad and oddly assorted humanity and assortments of music.
Should a gay parade be a procession of dour people in business suits (Actually a very interesting concept - so gay we are straight!)? Or should it simply be a joyous procession? Should it be a carnival or should it be a march of protest?
I admit to never having attended any pride event anywhere. I have no yardstick to measure by. So I am simply asking questions here.
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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marc
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Needs to get a life! |
Registered: March 2003
Messages: 4729
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The fact that court costs there seem to be a bit expensive.
Well very expensive.....
Life is great for me... Most of the time... But then I meet people online... Very few are real friends... Many say they are but know nothing of what it means... Some say they are, but are so shallow...
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marc
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Needs to get a life! |
Registered: March 2003
Messages: 4729
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I understand your comparison to Carnival or Mardi Gras.... But the perception of an event is not only physical but historical as well. Carnival has established roots and one goes into the frey with percieved expectations.
Pride parades tend to leave the spectator with a reinforced set of preconcieved ideas.
Now to clarify one point...... by spectator I refer to str8 people.
and yes ALOT of str8 people go to the parade.
Life is great for me... Most of the time... But then I meet people online... Very few are real friends... Many say they are but know nothing of what it means... Some say they are, but are so shallow...
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Apparently the costs were intended to be punitive. Here is a communiqué put out by the Jerusalem Open House, the organizers of the Parade.
The 4th Jerusalem Pride to take place as scheduled on June 30; Court accepts in full the JOH petition against the City
Jerusalem, June 26 2005 – Today, the Jerusalem District Court accepted in its entirety the Jerusalem Open House’s appeal against the Jerusalem Municipality: “The City is not permitted to discriminate against any sector of the public due to the disagreement of any of its officials to the views or sexual orientation of a particular sector… The City’s public facilities are intended for the use of the general public… In the circumstances before us, preference should be given to the freedom of expression and the right to equality.”
Jerusalem District Court deputy president, Judge Arad, added in her judgment: “The decision of the City and the mayor to ‘wash their hands’ of the [Pride] march and the associated rally deviates from the realm of reasonableness and it is only just that it be annulled. Defendants 1 and 2 [the Municipality and the mayor] will execute all the necessary actions in order to allow for the holding of the Pride march and rally on June 30, as detailed in the appeal. They will also ensure the hanging of rainbow flags along the said streets, as soon as possible, ahead of the abovementioned date.”
In her judgment, Judge Arad ruled costs of an unprecedented NIS 60,000 (US$ 13,200) to be paid in equal parts by the City – and by the mayor personally.
Hagai El-Ad, executive director of the Jerusalem Open House: “Today’s court decision is a victory, not only for the gay and lesbian community, but also a victory for freedom of expression. All those who truly hold Jerusalem dear to them will join in celebrating together on June 30, at the fourth annual Jerusalem Pride: Love Without Borders.”
Program of events for Thursday, 30th June:
· 18:30 Assembly at the top of Ben Yehuda Street
· 19:00 The march through downtown Jerusalem: Ben Yehuda, King George and Keren Hayesod Streets to Liberty Bell Park
· 20:00 Rally and festival at Liberty Bell Park
For further and updated details about Jerusalem Pride week, contact the Jerusalem Open House:
7 Ben Yehuda Street
Tel: +972 (2) 625 3191
http://www.gay.org.il/joh
The paradox has often been noted that the United States, founded in secularism, is now the most religiose country in Christendom, while England, with an established church headed by its constitutional monarch, is among the least. (Richard Dawkins, 2006)
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13796
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Inherently, then, it seems to be that the organisers need to get a grip on good taste? Though a bloke n an exotic frock seems more acceptable at a carnival than in a gay pride parade?
Hoever, banning parades by authorities does seem rather over the top
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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marc
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Needs to get a life! |
Registered: March 2003
Messages: 4729
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I never said banning was a solution.
Life is great for me... Most of the time... But then I meet people online... Very few are real friends... Many say they are but know nothing of what it means... Some say they are, but are so shallow...
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13796
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no indeed. I was not aiming that at you at all
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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But not without incident, as can be seen from this account which a friend who participated e-mailed me. So you see one does not have to be gay to participate in the Jerusalem Pride March - but you do have to be brave! This is part of what he wrote:
This evening marked the fifth annual Jerusalem Pride Parade. A festive event it was for the 8,000 or so who came to march from Ben Yehuda Street to Liberty Bell Park (by the Inbal Hotel). As promised, the parade was very much a Jerusalem style event. There were very few flamboyant costumes, such as one sees in Tel Aviv. Yes, there were some. And the press crowded round those individuals.
There were those who took advantage of the parade to carry signs for various liberal causes. There was clearly a mix of Gay and straight marchers. There seemed to be very few Arabs, but to be 'out' in the Arab community is far more taboo than it is in the Israeli Jewish community.
The Parade ended with a "happening" in the park. There were merchants, food booths, music, a huge dance area, and performances. There were not a few Kippot [skullcaps] to be seen, although clearly most were not from the religious sector.
I am pleased that I saw at least seven rabbis marching.
As we passed the seat of the Chief Rabbinate, two ultra-orthodox members of the Knesset (one was Menachem Porush) laid down on King George Street. They were carried away by the police who behaved meritoriously in protecting the crowd.
The parade was marred by three stabbings! The police,who were out in great force,arrested a twenty something year old ultra-orthodox man who will be charged with attempted murder. It is never easy living in Jerusalem. I arrived at the carnage of the Sabarro bombing a few years back before the police did. But to see a man and a woman bleeding heavily (I did not see the third victim) shocked even this Jerusalemite. A trail of blood stained the street as the man, stabbed in the belly, kept walking toward his young daughter who was crying nearby. I see it as part of the lawlessness that seems to be gripping some of the religious community.
The paradox has often been noted that the United States, founded in secularism, is now the most religiose country in Christendom, while England, with an established church headed by its constitutional monarch, is among the least. (Richard Dawkins, 2006)
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You can read about it here:
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3108498,00.html
The paradox has often been noted that the United States, founded in secularism, is now the most religiose country in Christendom, while England, with an established church headed by its constitutional monarch, is among the least. (Richard Dawkins, 2006)
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The ultra-orthodox guy who tried to stick a knife into three people taking part in the Jerusalem Pride Parade has been convicted of attempted murder. Sentencing at a later date. http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3208486,00.html
Justice is being done.
The paradox has often been noted that the United States, founded in secularism, is now the most religiose country in Christendom, while England, with an established church headed by its constitutional monarch, is among the least. (Richard Dawkins, 2006)
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13796
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Whatever the sentence he will feel his martyrdom was essential. It is likely, however, to encourage others not to stab people in parades.
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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Today Schissel was sentenced to 12 years in prison. The judges added a note about his "contempt of court". This makes good reading and is worth the couple of minutes it takes:
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3212934,00.html
The paradox has often been noted that the United States, founded in secularism, is now the most religiose country in Christendom, while England, with an established church headed by its constitutional monarch, is among the least. (Richard Dawkins, 2006)
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Re: Homophobic Mayor Fined 
