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You are here: Home > Forum > A Place of Safety > General Talk > Famous Gay Guys again
Famous Gay Guys again  [message #25732] Fri, 12 August 2005 14:06 Go to next message
NW is currently offline  NW

On fire!
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Time for someone American again ...
  • Attachment: who is he.jpg
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"The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral, begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy. ... Returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night devoid of stars." Martin Luther King
Re: Famous Gay Guys again  [message #25733 is a reply to message #25732] Fri, 12 August 2005 14:54 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Deeej is currently offline  Deeej

Needs to get a life!
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Methinks this game is slightly biased in favour of the older members of this board...

I can use an encyclopaedia, but you can't look up photographs in one.

Any chance of a clue? Smile

David
Re: Famous Gay Guys again  [message #25734 is a reply to message #25733] Fri, 12 August 2005 14:59 Go to previous messageGo to next message
NW is currently offline  NW

On fire!
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Ummm ... just classically American, I guess.



"The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral, begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy. ... Returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night devoid of stars." Martin Luther King
Re: Famous Gay Guys again  [message #25736 is a reply to message #25732] Fri, 12 August 2005 20:48 Go to previous messageGo to next message
ron is currently offline  ron

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If I don't answer this one (and do so correctly!), then my reputation with some people here may completely implode.

It's one of America's (and the world's) all-time greatest and most beloved composers, Aaron Copland.

As for his importance in gay history, here's one tidbit. It was his gayness (along with his being Jewish, no doubt) which caused him to be called before that most un-American entity known as the House Committee on Un-American Activities (depite their claim that is was because of Copland's involvement years earlier with what they deemed to be "subversive" organizations), chaired by a most vile heap of debris known as Senator Joseph McCarthy (he and the current US president would have gotten on famously, I'm sure!). The transcripts of his testimony before that committee make for interesting reading (and can be easily found with a Google search). Suffice it to say here, what makes this all the more ludicrous (and therefore all the more disgusting) is that Copland composed some the most innately "American" music of all time ("Appalachian Spring", "Lincoln Portrait", the ballets "Billy the Kid" and "Rodeo", the 12 song settings of poems by Emily Dickinson, the two sets of arrangements of Old American Songs, the list is all but endless). Among the best recordings of most of those pieces, by the way, were those made in England with Copland himself conducting the London Symphony Orchestra and the New Philharmonia Orchestra (you younger people: put aside the Green Days and the Backstreet Boys and the [ack!] Britney Spears for awhile and check them out!).

And Deeej, methinks I hear you, and it is definitely a point well taken! The problem, I'm afraid, is that gay history just isn't taught in school, and (sadly) probably won't be for quite some time to come (I don't know what it's like in the UK, but look at here in the US where it took a most inordinate amount of time before Black History gained even a modicum of "mainstream" acceptance). Perhaps that's one reason Timmy is promoting these postings. Anyway, again, your comment is most valid one. I guess the "honor" now falls to me the start the next "Famous Gay" thread. I'll be at Tanglewood (one of the most musical places on Earth, where Aaron Copland spent many a summer) for concerts on Saturday and Sunday; perhaps that will help inspire me to pick somebody that people younger than me might have an honest chance of guessing.



We do not remember days...we remember moments.

Cesare Pavese
Re: Famous Gay Guys again  [message #25737 is a reply to message #25736] Fri, 12 August 2005 21:05 Go to previous messageGo to next message
NW is currently offline  NW

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Aaron Copland it is.

I have to admit that it's only fairly recently - ie the last couple of years - that I realised he was gay: I think because I'd only heard the music at concerts or on the radio, so hadn't really come across a biography.

And I confess that I stay well away from anything to do with McCarthy ... I find the blight of much of a generation of talented composers, artists, writers, film-makers is just to depressing to contemplate. I can't even work up anger over it, it's too upsetting.



"The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral, begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy. ... Returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night devoid of stars." Martin Luther King
icon14.gif Re: Famous Gay Guys again  [message #25739 is a reply to message #25736] Fri, 12 August 2005 22:13 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Deeej is currently offline  Deeej

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Having said that, expecting it to be someone I had never heard of... I do know who Aaron Copland is (though it's unlikely I would know what he looked like). I have various pieces of his music, and while I wouldn't call myself a fan in particular, I have appreciated his music from time to time.

I don't know much about the New Philharmonia Orchestra, but the LSO is appreciated by far more people than would probably be aware of it: John Williams and the Star Wars music come to mind.

Thanks, ron. I found that very interesting.

David
Gay history  [message #25740 is a reply to message #25736] Fri, 12 August 2005 22:26 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Deeej is currently offline  Deeej

Needs to get a life!
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On the subject of "gay history" -- no, there is definitely nothing like that in the UK curriculum. Historically, there was also the problem of section 28, and most people don't seem to realise it doesn't exist any more.

You can find modules on that sort of subject at universities over here, but only for people with a specific interest. Not general interest.

Actually, at my secondary school, there was scope for something like that as part of our general education (we had a block of lessons set aside for that purpose). I fail to believe that (some of) the teachers were unaware of the issues. I wonder why they never broached the subject.
Re: Gay history  [message #25741 is a reply to message #25740] Fri, 12 August 2005 22:59 Go to previous message
NW is currently offline  NW

On fire!
Location: Worcester, England
Registered: January 2005
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As it happens, I was wearing a T-shirt from the original campaign against clause 27 / section 28 (which has now been relegated to night attire) when I read your post. It did make me feel quite historic!

I'm not sure that I'm in favour of teaching gay history on schools as a separate subject: I have always been an "assimilationist" at heart, and don't think such segregation does heterosexuals, bisexuals, or homosexuals any longterm favours. What I am very firmly in favour of is not ignoring the sexuality of people that crop up in studying other subjects. I think it's sad that, in my whole school career, I can only think of four figures/couples we studied that were explicitly referred to as not exclusively heterosexual (Britten, Edward II, Mao Zedung, Shakespeare ... plus partners) other than the safe figures of "classical antiquity". This meant that, although I knew something of the importance of Alan Turing for example, the fact of his opression and the symbolism of his death were not touched on.

But I suppose such "inclusive" teaching can only happen if appropriate university "departments of Queer Studies" construct some kind of an appropriate narrative context for trainee teachers.



"The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral, begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy. ... Returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night devoid of stars." Martin Luther King
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