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From the press, FYI:
The leader of the largest branch of American Judaism blasted conservative religious activists in a speech last Saturday, calling them "zealots" who claim a "monopoly on God" while promoting anti-gay policies akin to Adolf Hitler's. Rabbi Eric Yoffie, president of the liberal Union for Reform Judaism, said "religious right" leaders believe "unless you attend my church, accept my God and study my sacred text you cannot be a moral person. What could be more bigoted than to claim that you have a monopoly on God?" Yoffie asked his audience of about 5,000 in his keynote address during the movement's national assembly in Houston, Texas.
Yoffie used particularly strong language to condemn conservative attitudes toward homosexuals. He said he understood that traditionalists have concluded gay marriage violates Scripture, but he said that did not justify denying legal protections to same-sex partners and their children. "We cannot forget that when Hitler came to power in 1933 one of the first things that he did was ban gay organizations," Yoffie said. "Yes, we can disagree about gay marriage. But there is no excuse for hateful rhetoric that fuels the hellfires of anti-gay bigotry."
The Union for Reform Judaism represents about 900 synagogues in North America with an estimated membership of 1.5 million people. Of the three major streams of US Judaism - Orthodox and Conservative are the others - it is the only one that, at present, sanctions gay ordination and supports civil marriage for same-gender couples.
Yoffie's lengthy speech first addressed several other issues, and his criticism of conservative religious activists came in the middle. The audience was largely sedate until Yoffie reached that topic and responded with repeated, enthusiastic applause. Yoffie did not mention evangelical Christians directly in his speech, using the term "religious right" instead. In a separate interview, he said the phrase encompassed conservative activists of all faiths.
Yoffie said the activists have little understanding of the liberal religious community, which he insisted also grounds its beliefs in biblical teaching. "We study religious texts day and night, but we have no direct lines to heaven and we aren't always sure that we know God's will," he said. "We bring a measure of humility to our religious belief." Yoffie said liberals and conservatives share some concerns, such as the potential damage to children from violent or highly sexual TV shows and other popular media. But he said, overall, conservatives too narrowly define family values, making a "frozen embryo in a fertility clinic" more important than a child, and ignoring poverty and other social ills. "When they cloak themselves in religion and forget mercy, it strikes us as blasphemy," Yoffie said, urging a renewal of religious tolerance in the United States. "We need beware the zealots who want to make their religion the religion of everyone else."
The paradox has often been noted that the United States, founded in secularism, is now the most religiose country in Christendom, while England, with an established church headed by its constitutional monarch, is among the least. (Richard Dawkins, 2006)
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marc
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Needs to get a life! |
Registered: March 2003
Messages: 4729
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What wilderness?
Life is great for me... Most of the time... But then I meet people online... Very few are real friends... Many say they are but know nothing of what it means... Some say they are, but are so shallow...
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cossie
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On fire! |
Location: Exiled in North East Engl...
Registered: July 2003
Messages: 1699
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The one stretching from the Atlantic to the Pacific, North of the Gulf and South of the Canadian Border?
For a' that an' a' that,
It's comin' yet for a' that,
That man tae man, the worrld o'er
Shall brithers be, for a' that.
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Marc wrote:
> What wilderness?<
Oh dear. Was I being too intellectual? Sorry.
(It was a reference to Isaiah 40:3)
Cossie's answer is also correct. 
The paradox has often been noted that the United States, founded in secularism, is now the most religiose country in Christendom, while England, with an established church headed by its constitutional monarch, is among the least. (Richard Dawkins, 2006)
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cossie
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On fire! |
Location: Exiled in North East Engl...
Registered: July 2003
Messages: 1699
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I confess that this post has no purpose other than to bring the topic to the head of the Board, because it merits further discussion. So get on the case, before I comment about the length of your ears ......
For a' that an' a' that,
It's comin' yet for a' that,
That man tae man, the worrld o'er
Shall brithers be, for a' that.
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to debate with you. 
What more can be said on this topic? As reported in the first item in this thread, that man said what several of us on this Board have been saying for some time. That is, as the immortal Bard said: "There is something rotten in the State of Denmark" (substitute the name of the country most applicable in the present context).
Religious fundamentalism is a cancer in the body politic of any society; when religious fundamentalism achieves political power it can cause more deaths and more suffering - mental, physical and emotional - than almost any other regime. This is a lesson of history.
Religious fundamentalism is by its very nature undemocratic. It says that the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth lies with me and therefore any contrary view that you may hold is, ipso facto, wrong and sinful. He who disagrees with me is a sinner.
Judging from the examples that are presented to us by the media almost daily I get the impression that it is the religious fundamentalists who are the abject sinners: they show all the signs of overweening pride and, like the devil, they quote scripture to their own ends.
Where is "God is love"? Where is "Love thy neighbour as thyself"? Where is "Let her among you without fault cast the first stone"?
Having now laid myself open to flame from all quarters I don my asbestos suit and prepare for the onslaught of the faithful.
We shall discuss privately, if you don't mind, the length of my ears - and any other part of my anatomy: you tell me about yours and I'll tell you about mine.  ) Hopefully, this has now returned the discussion to the top of the board - at least for a short while.
The paradox has often been noted that the United States, founded in secularism, is now the most religiose country in Christendom, while England, with an established church headed by its constitutional monarch, is among the least. (Richard Dawkins, 2006)
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Actually, this is SO typical of why religious dogmatism of any kind (and especially the assertion of the "inerrance" of any text)is a disaster:
King James (C21) Version says:
"3 The voice of him that crieth in the wilderness: "Prepare ye the way of the LORD; make straight in the desert a highway for our God."
American standard Version says:
"3 The voice of one that crieth, Prepare ye in the wilderness the way of Jehovah; make level in the desert a highway for our God. "
So is the crying or the preparing that's happening in the wilderness?
"The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral, begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy. ... Returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night devoid of stars." Martin Luther King
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cossie
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On fire! |
Location: Exiled in North East Engl...
Registered: July 2003
Messages: 1699
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Excuse me, JFR, I think there must be some mistake: I make a point of avoiding all this debating nonsense and simply tell everyone else what they ought to be thinking!
Perhaps, therefore, I'm not well placed to comment on this thread, since I've already told the American nation - several times! - what it ought to be thinking, but (as I suppose one might expect from rebellious colonials) they have the arrogance to think differently, or - in the case of those in the higher echelons of government - to avoid thinking at all. I simply don't know why I bother!
On a more serious note, having recently had the unpleasant experience of reading a few postings elsewhere from the ranting Republican right, I am appalled by the levels to which their self-righteous arrogance can rise. I have seen several variations on the theme that the demand for same-sex civil unions is the thin end of the wedge; a common cry is that this namby-pamby liberalism will lead to federal laws preventing Churches from preaching the true word of God - presumably a reference to Leviticus, but not, of course, to shellfish.
The USA is quite rightly proud of its constitutional traditions, not least the constitutional separation of religion and the state. But if the concept of freedom of religion permits public condemnation to an extent which severely restricts the civil liberty of the group condemned, how is the paradox to be resolved? I rather fancy that a fundamentalist Muslim mosque preaching support for suicide bombing in New York would not be well received, but where is the line to be drawn?
We all appreciate that senior US politicians are good at reconciling the irreconcilable (for example, they see themselves as world leaders but feel able to drive holes through international law at Guantanamo Bay) but I'd be interested to know how the ordinary US citizen balances his cherished religious freedom against his cherished civil liberty.
Oh, and in conclusion, I wholeheartedly endorse NW's post above!
For a' that an' a' that,
It's comin' yet for a' that,
That man tae man, the worrld o'er
Shall brithers be, for a' that.
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with what Cossie has written and with what NW has written I'm not sure that there is much more that I can contribute. I suppose that I also agree with what JFR has written. I think.
The paradox has often been noted that the United States, founded in secularism, is now the most religiose country in Christendom, while England, with an established church headed by its constitutional monarch, is among the least. (Richard Dawkins, 2006)
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