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http://freecallplanet.com/call.html
I have been useing it to call jac it is real no charge.
So say what you want
(You know I'm wasting all my time)
You've gotta mean it when you say what you want
(You're only safe when you're alone)
And everybody's on your mind
Saying anything to get you by
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What is the catch? It can't be free for the people providing the service. Especially if you're using it to call a mobile phone.
David
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it free for thos of us in the us.
http://freecallplanet.com/technology.html
So say what you want
(You know I'm wasting all my time)
You've gotta mean it when you say what you want
(You're only safe when you're alone)
And everybody's on your mind
Saying anything to get you by
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Okay.
But there are still two problems:
i. How are they paying for the infrastructure in all those other countries? It's not normally free to make calls in the UK, for example, and especially to mobile phones (I'm assuming you're calling Jac on a mobile phone?).
ii. How are they paying for their infrastructure in the US, offices, staff, marketing, telephone lines? They don't seem to be making money on your calls to them, and they don't appear to be displaying advertising on the site. Companies don't provide something for nothing, even if they are using VOIP and it's not costing them as much as routing calls via international phone networks.
I would guess (if they really are doing what they say they are doing, without leeching money off you somehow) that it's a last-gasp thing to get "customers" with disregard for any viable business model and they'll go under any day now...
David
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My guess is that they're Chi-Com's (People's Republic of China). Clicking some of the links on the site brought up things in Bejing and other locations in the country.
Why are they doing it? Beats the hell outa me. I could be all wet anyhow.
“There's no grays, only white that's got grubby. I'm surprised you don't know that. And sin, young man, is when you treat people as things. Including yourself. That's what sin is.” - Terry Pratchett
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There is certainly a China connection, though whether they are actually based in China or simply have contacts there, I don't know. http://www.callchinaforfree.com/ is almost the same site.
The whois database gives the following details:
Domain Name.......... callchinaforfree.com
Creation Date........ 2006-05-10
Registration Date.... 2006-05-10
Expiry Date.......... 2007-05-10
Organisation Name.... Call International For Free
Organisation Address. P O Box 99800
Organisation Address.
Organisation Address. EmeryVille
Organisation Address. 94662
Organisation Address. CA
Organisation Address. US
The address on the site is:
Free Call Planet
318 N. Carson Street #208
Carson City NV 89701-0000
info@freecallplanet.com
These may be postal boxes, for all I know. But there must be some US presence.
Not knowing much about the American phone system, I would be inclined to worry that there is some stealth, premium-rate charge we don't know about. Jay has told me that it's just showing as a local rate on his phone bill. Are there any Americans who might be able to comment?
The other idea I have had is that perhaps it really is free for the end-user, but they are exploiting a loophole in another provider's system which means they get unrestricted access to their network for a very low flat rate. In other words, they do not have a business model, but it's so cheap for them that they don't really need one. That would mean the service is liable to stop existing at any stage, however, should anyone realise somewhere down the line that people are getting something for nothing. It happened in the UK a few years ago for free-call ISPs.
David
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13800
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I alwasy get suspicious when I can't see the business model. It comes to mind that this is a great way of collecting a list of real destination phone numbers and real source phone numbers globally that will then be used for marketing purposes. Otherwise I can't see how they can make any money.
In many ways the model is skype-like.
Their marketing obviously works. After all you have linked to it. Yet every call through them loses them money.
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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marc
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Needs to get a life! |
Registered: March 2003
Messages: 4729
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This scam is nothing more than a phishing trip down the road of nothingiseverfree.
Just that plain, just that simple....
Life is great for me... Most of the time... But then I meet people online... Very few are real friends... Many say they are but know nothing of what it means... Some say they are, but are so shallow...
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marc
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Needs to get a life! |
Registered: March 2003
Messages: 4729
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Now, think about it a minute. There are cross-atlantic companies that litteraly spend thousands of dollars per day in international calls. Don't you think they would embrace this with a vengence if it were even moderately legitimate?
Companies do NOT use these scams because they do not want the competition knowing who their clients are.
Life is great for me... Most of the time... But then I meet people online... Very few are real friends... Many say they are but know nothing of what it means... Some say they are, but are so shallow...
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It's not that plain and simple if Jay really is getting something for nothing, as he says his phone bill is showing.
Even if they are phishing (or, worse, listening in) I can't believe that his and Jac's phone numbers are together worth up to the tens of pounds it may be costing the company in infrastructure and call charges (depending on how much they use it) to connect them.
It's still very odd.
David
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These services do exist. Skype offers a phone-out feature. Others offer phone-in and phone-out capabilities. They generally charge for the calls, of course (which is why this place rings alarm bells) but they are definitely cheaper than using ordinary telecom suppliers, especially internationally.
Of course, it's not as convenient as dialling normally and if you wanted it to be familiar and easy-to-use, you'd have to shell out hundreds or thousands of pounds on special hardware. Which is why most companies don't bother, I would guess.
I've worked for companies that have an arrangement along those lines -- VOIP phones rather than conventional ones. I never saw the phone bills, however.
David
[Updated on: Thu, 14 December 2006 11:35] |
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No Message Body
-
Attachment: untitled.JPG
(Size: 75.87KB, Downloaded 301 times)
So say what you want
(You know I'm wasting all my time)
You've gotta mean it when you say what you want
(You're only safe when you're alone)
And everybody's on your mind
Saying anything to get you by
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I can't read the name of the columns, but there don't appear to be any costs there, so it doesn't look very much like a bill to me. Are you sure they would show up if there were?
David
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oh yeah it will show up in the 5th colom dt is daytime
So say what you want
(You know I'm wasting all my time)
You've gotta mean it when you say what you want
(You're only safe when you're alone)
And everybody's on your mind
Saying anything to get you by
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Okay, I'll take your word for it. 
David
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to quote from their site
We do not charge you for the call from the US gateway to any of the countries in our Free Call Planet Metro Plan. However, you need to call one of the domestic US numbers listed to reach our gateway. To keep our costs down, we do not provide you with a toll-free number, but rather a regular, local number in the USA.
in otherwords, if you call their "gateway number" from outside of what would be a local call, it charges you for that call. on the other hand, if you're calling the gateway from a mobile (cell) with free minutes on it, you're simply spending your free minutes on a local rate no. as opposed to the international court.
so its not exactly free...
its like paying UK local rate call charges to call the US.
i still prefer Skype though
incidentally, only certain countries can be called "free" though the list is fairly long, and also note
Q::
For how long will it remain FREE?
A::
We currently have not set an expiration, but may withdraw a country from the Free Call Planet Metro Plan at any time
Odi et amo: quare id faciam, fortasse requiris.
Nescio, set fieri sentio et excrucior
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Aden said,
>so its not exactly free...
>its like paying UK local rate call charges to call the US.
True -- but when you call them, the money presumably all goes to the network operator you are using, not them (unless they have some mechanism for getting a cut, as there was for pay-as-you-go dial-up ISPs like Freeserve). Even if they do get a little cut, I don't believe it would cover anything like the cost all the way to the UK (via the internet, then output over foreign telephone wires at the other end).
>incidentally, only certain countries can be called "free" though the list is fairly long
http://freecallplanet.com/countries.html
All the countries I have contacts in are listed there, I think. Assuming I'm representative (well, if I were American) of the sort of people they wish to appeal to, that means they are "giving away" access to the most potentially lucrative countries.
From the FAQ:
>We currently have not set an expiration, but may withdraw a country from the Free Call Planet Metro Plan at any time
I would be very surprised if they can keep it up for any length of time -- but I can't be any more specific than that as the business model is still completely unclear to me.
David
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13800
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the economiies of scale are huge, usually. And, if they are selling the numbers, at $0.75 per named number and $0.03 oer unnamednumber, they can be sold many times over and large profits made
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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more than likely that is what they r doing. but on the other had markiting cell phone numbers r no good cuz there is a law that says if u call a cell phone to sell a producted the number must be hand dialed
So say what you want
(You know I'm wasting all my time)
You've gotta mean it when you say what you want
(You're only safe when you're alone)
And everybody's on your mind
Saying anything to get you by
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Jay wrote:
> more than likely that is what they r doing. but on the other had markiting cell phone numbers r no good cuz there is a law that says if u call a cell phone to sell a producted the number must be hand dialed
Of couse if they are already criminals, that law would mean nothing to them.
(\\__/) And if you don't believe The sun will rise
(='.'=) Stand alone and greet The coming night
(")_(") In the last remaining light. (C. Cornell)
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Whitop
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Toe is in the water |
Location: USA
Registered: June 2005
Messages: 73
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In October, David Pogue who has written a weekly Technology column in the New York Times since 2000, wrote about Freedom Phone. Sounded too good to be true too. I called a friend in Vienna to say ‘Hi.’ And it worked. I’ve used it since. I have unlimited domestic long distance on my home phone and never use all the monthly time I have on my cell phone so any extra domestic long distance calls are free too.
Seeing this thread I checked back with Pogue’s blog, (http://pogue.blogs.nytimes.com/)
which I recommend to anyone interested in current electronic technology, and found a link to a believable explanation (quoted below) of the business model you all are seeking. Freecallplanet’s phone numbers are in rural Iowa too so the same explanation whould apply.
I wonder if these local companies can handle the volume that is developing. Freedom phone has already added another number. -Mac
Attachment(which wouldn't attach.)
http://blog.tomevslin.com/2006/10/free_internatio.html
Free International Calls! NOT Too Good to be True
NY Times technology blogger David Pogue posted about a company called Future Phone which offer free international calls to landlines in 54 countries around the world. I think I understand the arbitrage play which makes this profitable for Future Phone.
You don’t use a computer to call, don’t need special equipment, don’t listen to ads, don’t even register with them. You just call their number in Iowa (which may be a toll call for you), then dial the international number you want to reach. You can do this from your home or cellular phone (or from Skype or Vonage if you want).
David’s readers are skeptical saying this sounds too good to be true. Many have tried it and most report that they did get through as advertised. None report being solicited for anything else.
Future Phone says it plans to make money by selling future services. They say that they’ll be offering these free calls until 2010. What they don’t say is why this service doesn’t bankrupt them in the meantime. But I think I know.
The cost side is straightforward. Calls to landlines in these companies are dirt cheap at the wholesale level because last mile service has been deregulated. I suspect that VoIP is being used for lots of these calls but even traditional wholesalers of international calls have had to lower their rates for calling landlines in places like the UK to the penny/minute range.
Because mobile phone operators have a monopoly on reaching their own subscribers and, outside of North America, charge the CALLING party for reaching one of their numbers, the cost to a carrier to reach a mobile phone is high. That’s why Future Phone doesn’t offer calls to cell phones outside the US and Canada and why Vonage excludes calls to European mobile phones from its unlimited free calls to the US, UK and some other European countries option.
OK, losing even a penny/minute on something which will get widely used still isn’t a very good business. How does Future Phone do it?
Here’s my guess; it’s how I would run this arbitrage business. When you make a domestic long distance call in the US, you indirectly pay a terminating “access charge” to the carrier who owns the last mile connection to whomever you are calling. For the vast majority of the US, these terminating access charges are much less than a penny/minute (and still exorbitant at that price and very profitable for the local phone company).
However, some rural carriers have been allowed by the local regulators to charge much higher terminating access charges. When I was last running ITXC in 2004, some areas still cost $.08/minute for termination. The stated reason is that the rural carriers need this indirect subsidy. The politics of this is that all politics are local and the extra cost is born by the callers, not the locals. In fact, since almost all carriers offer a fixed or flat rate for calling the US, the cost of reaching these rural areas is spread over all callers even though the wholesale carrier does have to pay it per actual minute to the rural carrier who has the lucrative franchise.
The number given on the Future Phone website is in Superior, Iowa and belongs to something called the Superior Telephone Cooperative according to http://www.411.com. A footnote says that ownership of some of these numbers has been transferred due to local number portability. It’s a very good guess (but I don’t know that it’s true) that Superior, IA is one of the places with very high termination rates. I’d further guess that Future Phone either is the carrier receiving the calls or that it has a deal to get a good share of the terminating access charge revenue.
Net it out: If Future Phone gets even four cents for each minute inbound to them and pays one or two cents for each outbound minute to the international destinations, they have a very good arbitrage business going indeed. In fact, they’ll get paid for the dial time and ring time on the outbound leg and’ll get paid for the inbound leg even when the outbound leg is busy, doesn’t answer, or is “call can’t be completed”.
What’s this mean to you? I’d say use Future Phone if you want to save money calling these countries. It’s NOT to good to be true.
What’s the global lesson? Stupid, uneconomic structures like artificially high terminating access charges invite arbitrage. Someone’ll always figure it out.
End of attachment
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