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Guys I may not be back. I thought that the moderator was here to prevent anyone from saying something that would be the cause of an argument or word fights between posters. Now I see that the moderator is censoring the post because he (or she) doesnt like a word that was used. There is a big difference between moderating the tone of a discussion and censoring language. If I was the moderator and decided I didnt like the use of the word Rabbit and started editing out that word, would that be right? At what point does it stop. The moderator is not supposed to be a censor in the sence that they can determine what language we use.
If you stand for Freedom, but you wont stand for war, then you dont stand for anything worth fighting for.
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marc
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Needs to get a life! |
Registered: March 2003
Messages: 4729
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I agree...
But the forum Gods Tim sets in place are omnipotent and as such can by definition do no wrong...
BTW... what have you got against Rabbits?
Life is great for me... Most of the time... But then I meet people online... Very few are real friends... Many say they are but know nothing of what it means... Some say they are, but are so shallow...
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I dont believe censorship was Timmy's goal in setting up the moderators. They were to help keep peace, not censor the use of words. Once they start censoring the words we use, soon they will start censoring ideas. So anything they disagree with they will just edit it out. This is not what Timmy intended.
If you stand for Freedom, but you wont stand for war, then you dont stand for anything worth fighting for.
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marc
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Needs to get a life! |
Registered: March 2003
Messages: 4729
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But there has always been some form of censorship here.
Life is great for me... Most of the time... But then I meet people online... Very few are real friends... Many say they are but know nothing of what it means... Some say they are, but are so shallow...
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I have never seen Timmy edit anything because of a word that was used. If the moderator doesnt like certain words then he shouldnt use them, but its not his place to decide what words others should use. I expect pretty soon to see my post edited out, but what the hell. Oh my, hope hell isnt one of the words he doesnt like.
If you stand for Freedom, but you wont stand for war, then you dont stand for anything worth fighting for.
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Roger, I think that in principle you are right. But it must be very difficult - knowing the way we sometimes treat each other - to know what words may be hurtful and cause angry retorts. Perhaps the moderator thought that by editing words the poster may rethink the use of those words. I just don't know.
But, Roger, what advice would you give to the moderator when faced with some possibly insulting words? I think that my advice would be just to delete the post entirely. In that way no insult will have been offered and the original poster can always post the message again in less offensive terms.
I suppose we must always bear in mind that this moderation thing is something that we brought upon ourselves.
Just my twopennyworth.
J F R
The paradox has often been noted that the United States, founded in secularism, is now the most religiose country in Christendom, while England, with an established church headed by its constitutional monarch, is among the least. (Richard Dawkins, 2006)
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marc
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Needs to get a life! |
Registered: March 2003
Messages: 4729
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Moderation is one thing....
Thought policing is quite another.
Life is great for me... Most of the time... But then I meet people online... Very few are real friends... Many say they are but know nothing of what it means... Some say they are, but are so shallow...
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What do you mean, Roger, 'you may not be back'?
I do hope you aren't suggesting that you might be giving up this forum. You would be missed.
I agree with you if you are saying that there is no word that ought to be off limits in a place like this. And the only reason that we ought not to accept any picture or any video is that we want people to be able to recommend us to children who need our support and so we don't want anyone to be able to say 'but how can you recommend a site with this sort of thing on it . . . ?'
I agree with you that, although it may be wise not to disclose it to the forum, nothing should be censored without giving a reason and the reason ought to be doubtable and questionable.
But I have noticed that other forums do censor words and one of them replaces 'arse' with **** but accepts 'anus'. If it wasn't so stupid it would be laughable, wouldn't it?
Love,
Anthony
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Roger, are you talking about something specific or a principle? You have left me completely mystified.
One forum I used to contribute to had an automatic censor, but if you replaced R with ®, or C with © it couldn't handle it.
Hugs
N
I dream of boys with big bulges in their trousers,
Never of girls with big bulges in their blouses.
…and look forward to meeting you in Cóito.
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If a word or sentence is inflamable or could hurt someones feelings then the entire statement should have been deleted. I had no problem with the moderator removing an entire sentence or paragraph, but where it says "word removed by moderator", I have a problem with that. I agree that if a word is inflamatory the entire paragraph should be removed and a note left for the author to rewrite. To edit out a single word just because they dont like it or it offended them is going way beyond the intent. I could mention people thru history that did this but Im sure this would be edited out fast.
And Yes Acam, If this is the state of affairs on this board now then I will stop coming here. I have been friends with Timmy a long time and I admire him for all he has done, but once censorship starts and the individuals find that they can get away with it, where will it stop? Then this board becomes like all the others and it looses its personality and the reason all of us come here to begine with.
If you stand for Freedom, but you wont stand for war, then you dont stand for anything worth fighting for.
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JimB
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Likes it here |
Registered: December 2006
Messages: 349
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This is off the subject but maybe you'd be kind enough to answer my question Nigel. You used two characters that are not found on the keyboard, the R in a circle and the C in a circle. I have often wondered how you "key" such characters. Years ago there was a 'hex' key on the keyboard that would allow you to key the hex representation of any character but modern keyboards don't have such a key. If you could tell me how you do it I would appreciate it.
JimB
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If you are using windows Xp you use windows charmap ( character mapping) to get to that click start> run> type in "charmap" ( without the ") and left click ok.
Paul Jamison
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JimB
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Likes it here |
Registered: December 2006
Messages: 349
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Thanks Paul. That is just what I was looking for. JimB
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Hey Roger Hugs
"Keep as cool as you can man face piles of trials with smiles" (Moody's)
Dude I don't agree with it either but for you to leave would be an acquiescence don't you think. Rather stay and help change it and make it a better place. Keep on thinking free!
People will tell you where they've gone
They'll tell you where to go
But till you get there yourself you never really know
Where some have found their paradise
Other's just come to harm
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pipo
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Toe is in the water |
Registered: July 2008
Messages: 35
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As you probably have seen, charmap also tells you how to enter those characters on the keyboard (Keystroke: in the lower right corner). If you use special characters a lot, entering keystroke codes is quicker than using charmap if you have a full keyboard with a numeric keypad.
charmap shows only 4 digit unicode keystroke codes, some western characters also have a 3-digit keystroke code, e.g., Alt+130 for é. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Code_page_437
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Answered by PM.
?¨©ß
Nigel
I dream of boys with big bulges in their trousers,
Never of girls with big bulges in their blouses.
…and look forward to meeting you in Cóito.
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John..
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Toe is in the water |
Registered: March 2008
Messages: 56
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Hi Roger,
Dont over react the words are edited out so as not to cause offence, it might be a bit over the top,but it is needed to keep people calm.
Mine have been edited out, during the heat of the moment we can all offend others with our words. or statments.
People that chat here are at all diffeent levels of interlec.
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unsui
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Likes it here |
Registered: September 2007
Messages: 338
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No Message Body
[Updated on: Fri, 24 October 2008 17:50] |
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Michael, did I miss something?  ::-)
People will tell you where they've gone
They'll tell you where to go
But till you get there yourself you never really know
Where some have found their paradise
Other's just come to harm
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marc
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Needs to get a life! |
Registered: March 2003
Messages: 4729
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All I remember about it was a lot of kick ass fighting.
All the other crap just built up to it.
And crap it was.
Life is great for me... Most of the time... But then I meet people online... Very few are real friends... Many say they are but know nothing of what it means... Some say they are, but are so shallow...
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Wonderfully well written Michael. You are very correct that Buddisim is not a religion in itself, Zen buddisim is what Theologins call a "Life Philosophy". The actual religion is Hindu. In the Hindu religion all humans are trapped within a wheel of birth and death, this cycle was never ending. What Buddah did was show the Hindu's how to break the wheel. He gave them a way out of the trap of birth and rebirth. Buddah was the christ of the Hindus.
Zen is the ability to find peace within ones self. Not allowing the things of the world to directly influence us. It is creating a center of self and all other things move around this center. Outside forces, such as words move around the outside of the center. Altho we see or hear them they are not allowed to have an impact on the center, because it is unmoving.
Well enough philosophy. My point was that the entire paragraph should have been removed, not just one word. The meaning of the paragraph or sentence was just as clear with the word removed or not. the word was removed because the word offened somoneone and that is censorship in its most base and nasty form.
Once the moderators start editing out words, because they dont like them, then it is only going to get worse. With great power comes great responsibility. The moderator should have simply said to the poster to rethink what he has to say and rewrite it. Purhaps Im being to picky about this, but I have seen the way other forums have gone and I dont wish to see this one go that way.
If you stand for Freedom, but you wont stand for war, then you dont stand for anything worth fighting for.
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No Offense to Michael, but that was well written Roger!
Peace
People will tell you where they've gone
They'll tell you where to go
But till you get there yourself you never really know
Where some have found their paradise
Other's just come to harm
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JimB
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Likes it here |
Registered: December 2006
Messages: 349
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Two points for you Roger. One, I agree that the moderator should not remove single words. Either the writer has gone beyond the line with a sentence, paragraph or entire post or he has not; if he has the entire sentence, paragraph or post should be removed.
Secondly, being one who believes in reincarnation, what was the reason that Buddha wanted to give the Hindus a "way out of the trap"? Why was it considered a "trap", a negative?
I have learned a great deal from posts such as yours on this forum and look forward to you further extending my knowledge.
JimB
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marc
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Needs to get a life! |
Registered: March 2003
Messages: 4729
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The trap was the idea that there was no altering from the birth, life death cycle.
The Buddhist tradition is to raise the consciousness to a level of nervanna to the point of moving to a higher plane of existance.
[Updated on: Tue, 05 August 2008 10:34]
Life is great for me... Most of the time... But then I meet people online... Very few are real friends... Many say they are but know nothing of what it means... Some say they are, but are so shallow...
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Marc is correct and there are also other reasons. Because of the way you lived your life you might be reborn as an ant, a frog, a pig, etc.etc.. Even being reborn as a pig, karma follows you. If you werent a very good pig the next time you were reborn it might be as a cockroach and so on and so on. Budda said that you could attain a mental perfection and escape the cycle of life and move into another realm of existance. Now here is where things really get complicated. You may wind up being reborn because you are needed on earth to help someone else and it can get even more complicated so I wont go into it here. Rest assure reaching nervanna was and is no easy task. Remember, "Karma, what you give is what you get returned".
If you stand for Freedom, but you wont stand for war, then you dont stand for anything worth fighting for.
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marc
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Needs to get a life! |
Registered: March 2003
Messages: 4729
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A very long time ago I found myself in a conversation with a cadre of Buddhist monks along with several followers of some other world religions.
As the conversation progressed we eventually came upon the subject of afterlife.
It was then that one of the Buddhist monks brought up the comparison to life as a tapestry...
I.E. ... Each life is as a thread within a huge clothwork of infinate variety and colors. As one progresses through his life his thread comes into contact with other threads... some meerly touch and move on while some run in parallel for a time...
The concept was that we meet, follow, lead, enjoy, love, hate, cry... and so on... with others who are also a part of this same tapestry... which is so vast as to encompass every life force... past, present and future...
At the time... it was a hard and complicated image to grasp... but as the years trundled by the notion was more easily understood...
So remember.... No life goes on without affecting other lives... Sometimes in small ways and sometimes in ways so vast that it boggles the mind to grasp.
Life is great for me... Most of the time... But then I meet people online... Very few are real friends... Many say they are but know nothing of what it means... Some say they are, but are so shallow...
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Yes.....I cant remember exactly how this goes but its something like this. People come into our lives, some for a moment and for whatever reason move out and are gone, these have an effect on us at the moment. Then there are those who come into our lives for a time and then move on. these have a dramatic lasting affect on our lives. Then there are those who come into our lives for a lifetime. These are our loves and anchors and companions. When they are gone they take a part of our lives with them.
If you stand for Freedom, but you wont stand for war, then you dont stand for anything worth fighting for.
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marc
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Needs to get a life! |
Registered: March 2003
Messages: 4729
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Yup, that's essentialy it.... but the colors as i remember signify the mood of the interaction.
Life is great for me... Most of the time... But then I meet people online... Very few are real friends... Many say they are but know nothing of what it means... Some say they are, but are so shallow...
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Gee I thought I had turned you on to that one... ::-)
People will tell you where they've gone
They'll tell you where to go
But till you get there yourself you never really know
Where some have found their paradise
Other's just come to harm
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marc
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Needs to get a life! |
Registered: March 2003
Messages: 4729
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Nope.
Life is great for me... Most of the time... But then I meet people online... Very few are real friends... Many say they are but know nothing of what it means... Some say they are, but are so shallow...
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bonobo
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Getting started |
Registered: August 2008
Messages: 4
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Buddhism is in a sense what you make it but there are a few points of orthodoxy.
Nibbana/Nirvana is not another plane of existence - it's a condition without character but literally the word means "extinction". The Buddha taught that nibbana could not be defined except perhaps metaphorically. It is the condition of a flame once a fire has been extinguished. This is the reason that we practise meditation - we have to develop insight through deepening intuition because the nature of nibbana can't be captured in words or positive logic.
Rebirth has to be understood in Buddhism quite differently than in Hinduism as well. The Buddha taught that we are "anatta" that is ownerless, sometimes translated as "no self". But the only time that the Buddha was asked the question "is the self real" he refused to answer saying that both answers were "wrong views". To describe what is reborn, he used the analogy of a candle lighting another candle - nothing is passed from one to the other but the flame carries on. The aim in a sense is to let the flame die by avoiding kamma (which means action and includes the idea of moral causality). Sometimes Buddhists talk about good and bad kamma but strictly we seek a condition of no kamma at all! The Buddhist nun Ayya Khema once commented - humorously! on a slogan advertising a soft drink that said "Life - get into it!". The Buddhist attitude she said is "Life - get out of it!" This isn't nihilistic. Life in Buddhism is characterised as inherently suffused with suffering and nibbana is the alternative - a state devoid of suffering.
The reason that the Buddha taught the way to nibbana was he said because everything in life is transitory and therefor ultimately unsatisfactory. This causes us "dukkha" - suffering or ill ease - and we tend to make things worse by clinging to things in the hope that we can avoid dukkha that way. But we can't - the only thing to do is to acknowledge it and learn not to hanker after things: not clinging is all that can bring peace.
I don't intend to criticise anyone else's understanding of things - Buddhists believe that we should all test ideas for ourself and persist with what brings peace.
Metta!
bonobo.
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Way cool a Buddhist scholar. I have a question.
By passing on this information in this fashion do you not accumulate a great deal of Kamma, therefore being the antithesis of what you seek ?
peace
Rick
People will tell you where they've gone
They'll tell you where to go
But till you get there yourself you never really know
Where some have found their paradise
Other's just come to harm
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BTW I like the bonobo thing too I mean if the references is to the Bonobo Chimp. It evokes many questions. ?? I just seem to full of those these days.....
People will tell you where they've gone
They'll tell you where to go
But till you get there yourself you never really know
Where some have found their paradise
Other's just come to harm
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bonobo
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Getting started |
Registered: August 2008
Messages: 4
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Passing on the Buddha Sasana (Buddha's message) is kamma - I'm not skillful enough to manage my life without kamma...yet  . But, the action of passing on information (if it's done with the right intention) about the Dhamma is what Buddha calls "bright kamma" and the reaction it causes is generally not unpleasant! At least, I hope so...
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Thank you Bo Nobo. It was my intent to give an explination with out becoming to orthodox, a general understanding.
If you stand for Freedom, but you wont stand for war, then you dont stand for anything worth fighting for.
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BTW, just as an aside. How many peop[le have gone into a Chinese place and seen the fat little man sitting with his legs crossed. One of the first things you hear most people say is "OOOOO Buddah". Just so you will know, that is not a statue of the Buddah. that is a statue of a Chinese god named Ho Tai. If you rub his belly it is supposed to bring you good luck and fortune. So the next time you see this little man amaze your friends with your vast knowledge, LOL.
If you stand for Freedom, but you wont stand for war, then you dont stand for anything worth fighting for.
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JimB
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Likes it here |
Registered: December 2006
Messages: 349
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Thank you Bo Nobo. I am very grateful that you have shared with us the Buddha Sasana. I hope that it brings you much "bright kamma" as I have learned much from your words.
JimB
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An interesting facet about the bonobos to share:
"The species is best characterized as female-centered and egalitarian and as one that substitutes sex for aggression. Whereas in most other species sexual behavior is a fairly distinct category, in the bonobo it is part and parcel of social relations--and not just between males and females. Bonobos engage in sex in virtually every partner combination (although such contact among close family members may be suppressed). And sexual interactions occur more often among bonobos than among other primates. Despite the frequency of sex, the bonobo's rate of reproduction in the wild is about the same as that of the chimpanzee." [from March 1995 Scientific American, pp. 82-88]
Hee, hee! It would seem that we are a forum of bonobos
Youth crisis hot-line 866-488-7386, 24 hr (U.S.A.)
There are people who want to help you cope with being you.
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JimB
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Likes it here |
Registered: December 2006
Messages: 349
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I'm confused. Are you making fun of this poster's name? Is that a proper way to welcome someone new to this forum? Please explain yourself. I ask the same of Paul.
JimB
[Updated on: Thu, 07 August 2008 15:43] |
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