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From The New York Times:
"The future Pope Benedict XVI resisted pleas to defrock a California priest with a record of sexually molesting children, citing concerns including "the good of the universal church," according to a 1985 letter bearing his signature.
The correspondence, obtained by The Associated Press, is the strongest challenge yet to the Vatican's insistence that Benedict played no role in blocking the removal of pedophile priests during his years as head of the Catholic Church's doctrinal watchdog office.
The letter, signed by then-Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger, was typed in Latin and is part of years of correspondence between the Diocese of Oakland and the Vatican about the proposed defrocking of the Rev. Stephen Kiesle.
The Vatican confirmed Friday that it was Ratzinger's signature. ''The press office doesn't believe it is necessary to respond to every single document taken out of context regarding particular legal situations,'' the Rev. Federico Lombardi said."
Read More Here:
http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/us/AP-US-Pope-Church-Abuse.html?_r=2
Box Turtle Bulletin
http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2010/04/09/21731
The Daily Dish
http://andrewsullivan.theatlantic.com/the_daily_dish/2010/04/the-third-strike.html#more
[Updated on: Sun, 11 April 2010 03:47]
(\\__/) And if you don't believe The sun will rise
(='.'=) Stand alone and greet The coming night
(")_(") In the last remaining light. (C. Cornell)
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13800
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Now you have to remember that, according to this sect, this is all malicious gossip.
Anyway the age of consent on the vatican is 12, so this must all be fine, mustn't it?
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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JimB
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Likes it here |
Registered: December 2006
Messages: 349
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“The diocese recommended removing Kiesle (KEEZ'-lee) from the priesthood in 1981, the year Ratzinger was appointed to head the Vatican office that shared responsibility for disciplining abusive priests.”
“Kiesle had been sentenced in 1978 to three years' probation after pleading no contest to misdemeanor charges of lewd conduct for tying up and molesting two young boys in a San Francisco Bay area church rectory. As his probation ended in 1981, Kiesle asked to leave the priesthood and the diocese submitted papers to Rome to defrock him.”
“In the November 1985 letter, Ratzinger says the arguments for removing Kiesle are of ''grave significance'' but added that such actions required very careful review and more time. He also urged the bishop to provide Kiesle with ''as much paternal care as possible'' while awaiting the decision.”
“Kiesle was ultimately stripped of his priestly powers on Feb. 13, 1987, though the documents do not indicate how or why. They also don't say what role -- if any -- Ratzinger had in the decision.”
Convicted of molestation in 1978, requested defrocking in 1981, yet it took until 1987 to get rid of a pedophile. Quite revealing regarding the workings and thinking of the church and this pope.
JimB
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OK, these idiots in Rome need to pull the cassocks out of their butt cracks and stop making fools of themselves. After reading this it's a wonder any gay man will ever set foot in a Catholic church again.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/04/12/AR2010041202959.html
You can read the whole article from the Washington Post yourself, but this quote ought to grab you by the balls:
"The Vatican's second-highest authority says the sex scandals haunting the Roman Catholic Church are linked to homosexuality and not celibacy among priests."
"Cardinal Tarcisio Bertone, the Vatican's secretary of state, made the comments during a news conference Monday in Chile, where one of the church's highest-profile pedophile cases involves a priest having sex with young girls."
OK I'm a homosexual, I didn't know that was supposed to make me lust after little GIRLS. Apples and oranges in the same religious basket, I feel positively insulted.
I'm astounded. Homosexual behavior manifests itself in all species of creatures on the planet, none of them practice celibacy, that's unnatural. I think the cardinal's cute little red hat is on too tight, he ought to shove it up his ***.
:-/
Age appears to be best in four things; old wood best to burn, old wine to drink, old friends to trust, and old authors to read. (Sir Francis Bacon 1561-1626)
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Not only are homosexuals responsible. An Italian bishop has stated that the attacks on the pope and the church concerning sexual abuse are a Zionist plot concocted by the Jews. In 2010 this is spine-chilling. Here is a link to the British newspaper the Guardian:
http://tiny.cc/erz7j
It must be me who is planning to blow up the Church: I am a gay Zionist Jew.
J F R
The paradox has often been noted that the United States, founded in secularism, is now the most religiose country in Christendom, while England, with an established church headed by its constitutional monarch, is among the least. (Richard Dawkins, 2006)
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13800
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I think it would do no lasting harm to destroy the Roman Catholic Church. These people are insane, though, completely insane.
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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JFR...I don't know how much I can trust The Guardian to make accurate statements. This retired bishop has denied making such comments, that is his right, who do we believe?
We both know there are those who would love to stir the pot and those who would love to just watch it boil over. Either the bishop said those words or he didn't, I would like to see it confirmed in other media.
Credible journalism is a difficult thing to pin down. I look at mainstream sources like The Washington Post, even Slate Magazine online. Those are outlets which value their credibility and fact check, I do not know The Guardian.
But either way I don't think an 81 year old retired bishop would speak for the current Vatican establishment. Imagine that, me defending the Pope in a situation where he is defenseless and just plain out of his mind. ;-D
Age appears to be best in four things; old wood best to burn, old wine to drink, old friends to trust, and old authors to read. (Sir Francis Bacon 1561-1626)
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13800
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The Grauniad is a good mainstream reliable media source, though has a reputation for typos. It is as reliable as other broadsheet national UK press.
[Updated on: Tue, 13 April 2010 12:49]
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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How little we know of the inner workings of the Vatican, but over the centuries they seem to have developed an answer for everything.
Pope Benedict is now calling for the church to do penance. I wonder how that works? Since the church deals in sins, unfortunately leading by example in the case of priestly molestation of children, does this mean the collective church will say a few Hail Mary's and be done with it all?
Can the church say a few prayers and forgive itself? But of course they have a couple thousand years of practice in the forgiveness business. The issue becomes just who will do the penance? Do they draw names from a hat, do a secret ballot and then burn wet straw when some poor slob is chosen? You don't suppose the Pope will actually take responsibility...do you?
Penance used to take on all forms of physical abuse. Flogging bishops in the public square won't happen even if it should. The Inquisition could be re-instituted, the Pope might like that, might even resemble his Hitler Youth days. Or say they bring back selling indulgences...how much would selling forgiveness for raping young children bring into the coffers?
This is little more than a half assed solution, but leave it to the church to come up with something like this. Sorry, Pope Benny...no one is going to buy it.
News article follows:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/36554197/ns/world_news-world_faith
[Updated on: Thu, 15 April 2010 16:28]
Age appears to be best in four things; old wood best to burn, old wine to drink, old friends to trust, and old authors to read. (Sir Francis Bacon 1561-1626)
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13800
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How about stripping the Vatican of all its assets, compensating the abused properly, and probably stopping short of hanging, drawing and quartering the abusers, but giving then particularly tough jail time?
Any extra money can be used for true charitable purposes. Or to build a jail for the priests and nuns who abuse kids.
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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Penance? I do not believe that "doing penance" has any real meaning. My own tradition speaks of sincere repentance, atonement and forgiveness (in that order). And furthermore we have a belief that if you have wronged somebody else God will not forgive you if you have not yet received the forgiveness of the person you wronged. Just doing a penance is rather like making a New Year's resolution - and we all know how much they are worth.
A wrong done must be righted if at all possible. Repentance must be sincere and involves (among other things) an undertaking to do one's best never to do that wrong again. Just depriving oneself of eating meat for a week (for example) will never right any wrong at all.
I have no idea how the Universal Church (as it calls itself) can perform repentance, atonement and forgiveness - that is something that each and every malfeasant must do for himself. And if I were one of the abused I am not sure I would ever be able to find it my heart to forgive. That would require a greatness of heart that His Holiness, God's Representative on Earth, does not seem to have.
Apologies for the rant.
J F R
The paradox has often been noted that the United States, founded in secularism, is now the most religiose country in Christendom, while England, with an established church headed by its constitutional monarch, is among the least. (Richard Dawkins, 2006)
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... within the "Palace Guard" could be gaining momentum.
The following story featured yesterday morning at netscape.aol.com reveals that Cardinal Christoph Schönborn, of Austria and a former student of the current Pope whose efforts in the 2005 conclave were key to Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger's election as Benedict XVI. But, these days Schönborn has the Vatican and conservative Catholics wondering whether he's helping his friend, given the independent-minded streak Schönborn has shown amid the ongoing clergy sexual abuse crisis.
Let Priests Marry? Austrian Cardinal Schönborn roils the Vatican
http://www.politicsdaily.com/2010/05/18/let-priests-marry-austrian-cardinal-schonborn-roils-the-vatican/?icid=main|netscape|dl9|link1|http%3A%2F%2Fwww.politicsdaily.com%2F2010%2F05%2F18%2Flet-priests-marry-austrian-cardinal-schonborn-roils-the-vatican%2F
Unfortunately, there needs to be more voices heard, from parishes World-wide; and perhaps, just perhaps, Cardinal Christoph Schönborn has enough stature within the hierarchy of the The Vatican to encourage others to speak out and be heard; then maybe, but only just maybe, will "REAL" contrition and change be at all forthcoming.
Warren C. E. Austin
The Gay Deceiver
Toronto, Canada
[Updated on: Fri, 21 May 2010 06:49]
"... comme recherché qu'un délice callipygian"
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OH??? HA HA HA HA HA HA...and they expect this will scare someone? LMAO. Someone has been drinking too much of that communion wine...
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/37412892/ns/world_news-europe
Age appears to be best in four things; old wood best to burn, old wine to drink, old friends to trust, and old authors to read. (Sir Francis Bacon 1561-1626)
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Re: Future Pope Stalled..not any more!!! 
It would appear that dissention .... 
