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This title to my post may not be news to many of you living in the UK, but now your government has reached a new low.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100714/ap_on_sp_ot/us_lacrosse_iroquois_passports
The Native Americans under consideration are citizens of their own nation and thus have the right to hold passports from their nation even if it is inside the territory of the United States.
It's sad to say that these people invented the game of lacrosse and are not allowed to go play it. How would the people in the UK feel if say an English team was not allowed to play soccer in a foreign country? England has a lacrosse team in the competition, I would urge cancellation of the event or at least a major boycott of the events.
I urge the government in the UK to grow up. The Iroquois and their ancestors have lived on the American continent for the past 10,000 years. If things had turned out differently all us Americans would be holding Iroquois passports, they had a democratic society long before we even considered it.
Yes, I am pissed off...you should be too.
Age appears to be best in four things; old wood best to burn, old wine to drink, old friends to trust, and old authors to read. (Sir Francis Bacon 1561-1626)
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Chris James wrote:
(snip)
> but now your government has reached a new low.
Hang on tight - you ain't seen nothing yet. Governments in the UK of all political persuasions have been heading for a state of gibbering idiocy at an exponentially-increasing rate for the past couple of decades. I think someone must be putting something in the bottles at the Government Wine Cellar*
* The Government wine cellar holds approximately 37–39,000 bottles of wine at any given time. No distinction is made between blue chip" and fine" wines. Approximately 3–4,000 bottles of the stock are beverage or reception wines. Small quantities of spirits and liqueurs are held for general use. There has been no significant variation in the last five years.
From 2000–04 the valuation placed on the cellar was approximately £1.6 million. From 2004, on the advice of the National Audit Office, the valuation was changed to reflect the cost price of the stock rather than the previous market valuation. The cellar is now valued at around £0.7 million.
The total annual spend on the cellar varies from around £75,000 per annum to approximately £97,000, depending on stock levels and consumption. http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm200506/cmhansrd/vo050711/text/50711w11.htm
"The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral, begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy. ... Returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night devoid of stars." Martin Luther King
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LMAO, and I bet they don't pay tax on that wine either. Which reminds me...
My father worked at the White House for a number of years (a journalist, not one of those wonks with an absurd salary). He attended a dinner with then President Nixon and they were served wine with the meal. My father said it was an average red, nothing special.
He could see the wine stewart serving Nixon who had several glasses. But the bottle only served him and no others at the table, that caught my father's interest. So when the stewart left the table and proceeded back towards the kitchens my father stopped him and asked to see the bottle. The man hesitated but unwrapped the white napkin from the bottle.
Needless to say it was a $400 bottle of rare wine, I forget the name. King Nixon seems to have had his own cellar of expensive wines on the taxpayers tab.
You know Nixon's flaws, he was a crook in more ways than one.
Age appears to be best in four things; old wood best to burn, old wine to drink, old friends to trust, and old authors to read. (Sir Francis Bacon 1561-1626)
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I am sorry but I do not think the British government is out of it's mind at all. I do not think they need to grow up, but instead the Amirinds need to grow up. They reside in either the United States of America, or the Dominion of Canada, not their own fictitious "nation." If they want to carry around fake "national" passports and pretend they still live in some confederation of their own, let them. But I believe like every other citizen of the USA or Canada, they need to have real, honest-to-goodness government passports.
I think your comparison with the English soccer team is not valid. People in the United Kingdom might self-identify as English or Welsh or Scottish or Cornishmen or anything else, but I bet they all carry UNITED KINGDOM passports.
If this is carried to the obvious conclusion, we'll have Aztec passports for Mexican indians, and Incan passports for Peruvian indians and all kinds of crazy things.
Nations come and go on the world. Civilizations rise and fall. You can not bring back the past just because you have pretend passports.
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For Christ's sake, give them a break. Chalk it up to breaking numerous peace treaties. They invented the game, what are ya' scared that they are gonna kick yer British arse? The Brits got more problems than 23 Iroquois coming to play a game of lacross, the Iroquois are downright civilized, compared to beer guzzling limeys who regularly riot. And lets not tour any of the high and mighty British royals castles, at least one has rooms with hundreds of Indian scalps nailed to the walls as trophies from the colonies. Who is judging who has the spirit of sportsmanship and has better manners? In case you didn't know, the British were the ones who invented taking scalps. Read about it.
Author Of Above Comment Is Ronald:
http://profiles.yahoo.com/u/6MKIECFGXGLXOG5ZYNW3KKUBAM
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... signed in the Hague by amongst others the U.K., France, Russia and the U.S.A. says otherwise.
The Treaty was, in part, the basis of settlement reached with the First Nations Council of British North America which in effect deeded in perpetuity 2,800,000 square miles of Western, Central and Northern Territories (including the Arctic Islands) in North America (aka The Hudson's Bay Land Tract), to the Crown in right of The Dominion of Canada, and provided for the partition of western, northern and central Canada into what would become known as the Provinces of Alberta, Saskatchewan, Manitoba and The Northwest and Yukon Territories. In exchange, The Dominion of Canada guaranteed, again in perpetuity to the Din'eh residing within the territorial confines of The Dominion of Canada, freedom and relief from all taxation, access to free, good and sufficient, Healthcare (providing the earliest foundation of what would half-a-century later become The Nation Medicare Program) and Education, and through the provision of that 1905 Treaty, relief from all let and hindrance of any territory boundary or border on the face of the globe. The cross-border provisions required the ratification of that particular Treaty by all the power that be at that time, and applies to any indigenous peoples of the earth regardless of where they reside, provided they are adequately documented and identified by the jurisdiction of competent authority issuing that documentation. In Canada this means that any Din'eh in possession of a Canadian Government "Status Aboriginals" Card is free to travel anywhere in the World, and cannot be denied entry by any country excepting for grounds of known criminal, treasonous, seditious or warlike (read terrorist) behaviour.
This treaty was, and is why, Canada cannot ever refuse admission to an aboriginal from anywhere, and in particular lies at the heart of why American Wounded Knee dissidents couldn't be refused admission to Canada in the late 1970's and early 1980's even though they were traveling to Canada with the specific (and stated) intention to rabble rouse and incite Canadian aboriginals into supporting their claims against the U.S. government. It is also why Canadian authorities are powerless (as are the American) to hinder cross-border transport and commerce in the tobacco industry by aboriginals in the present day. Similarly this same treaty is at the heart of difficulties encountered by the U.S.S.R when attempting to police cross-arctic travel by the Inuit for the last half-century; and for similar reasons why Canada's Din'eh were so involved in the presentation and support of the recent Winter Olympics in Vancouver, as a greater majority of the events were held on Din'eh owned territorial reservation lands.
I have no knowledge of just what the U.S. government sponsored identity card issued to Status Aboriginals within their territorial boundaries is; but, to be sure one does exist, and has done since just after the turn of the last century; but, I hardly think that it would be a unique passport issued by The Iroquois Nation; and I do know that the Chiefs of the Six Nations Reserve in Southwestern Ontario (which include The Iroquois) would definitely have something to say about that.
I also have no knowledge of what the criteria are that would decide one' s being an Aboriginal Person, other than we were taught in school back in the day (and likely no more) these would have included The Maori in New Zealand, The Aboriginals in Australia, the Din'eh throughout all of North and South America, and similarily in Africa, Europe, Asia and the Pacific Islands, and Isuspect basically represented any originating culture that pre-existed settlement (and/or invasion) by another.
I also don't know the name of the Treaty (if I ever knew), although I'm certain we must have been taught its' name at one point or the other when dealing with the history of the partition of our country; but again, I doubt that this is taught any more either, as it wouldn't be deemed particularly politically correct.
Warren C. E. Austin
The Gay Deceiver
Toronto, Canada
[Updated on: Thu, 15 July 2010 07:00]
"... comme recherché qu'un délice callipygian"
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Perhaps the Iroquois could use their seat in the United Nations to bring their plight to the notice of the world.
The way the English team played in the World Cup it might be doing everyone a favour if they were banned from playing abroad.
The trouble is that having strong principles costs. The reason they cannot travel is pride, not international and governmental intransigence.
Hugs
N
I dream of boys with big bulges in their trousers,
Never of girls with big bulges in their blouses.
…and look forward to meeting you in Cóito.
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CabinBoy wrote:
(snip)
> People in the United Kingdom might self-identify as English or Welsh or Scottish or Cornishmen or anything else, but I bet they all carry UNITED KINGDOM passports.
Actually, we don't - we carry European Union passports marked with the State (in my case, United Kingdom), and many of us were pretty pissed off when we were force to change.
"The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral, begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy. ... Returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night devoid of stars." Martin Luther King
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Unfortunately, Cabin Boy, I believe you are the one who needs to grow up, or at least educate yourself.
The Aztec and the Inca suffered genocide at the hands of the Spanish, they are no more. The natives of North America suffered much the same fate at the hands of the French, then the English and finally the newly formed America.
From Washington to Jackson, the presidents all contributed in some way to the demise of the native population in the name of progress. This continued on into the twentieth century when children from various tribes were taken from their parents for re-education to stamp out the heathen ways. They were taught English and Christianity, Jesus must be so proud.
I wonder how your parents would feel if you were taken from their home and re-educated to become a member of a foreign country. Give the Chinese a chance, they own us now and so they might get the opportunity to do that. Let's just hope you are grown up by then.
Age appears to be best in four things; old wood best to burn, old wine to drink, old friends to trust, and old authors to read. (Sir Francis Bacon 1561-1626)
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RichardG
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Getting started |
Location: UK
Registered: December 2007
Messages: 12
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According to The Times today, the use of these forms of identity was outlawed by the US government post 9/11. The State Department have offered to expedite US passports for the players but this has been refused. Anyone want to eat humble pie.
Richard
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... in question might prove helpful to our readers; especially given that thetimes.co.uk is now a subscription site and it's difficult, if not next to impossible to locate anything not directly linked on the front page.
Warren C. E. Austin
The Gay Deceiver
Toronto, Canada
"... comme recherché qu'un délice callipygian"
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ray2x
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Really getting into it |
Location: USA
Registered: April 2009
Messages: 430
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I side with the Iroquois nation. Being of Mexican decent, I'm wondering if/when I'll need a passport to travel within my own country. This is not any hyperbole statement. It's looking more and more like "Mexican Season" in the Southwest.
Raymundo
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RichardG
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Getting started |
Location: UK
Registered: December 2007
Messages: 12
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I am one of those strange people who reads printed newspapers. I do not subscribe to the Times online. That is why I quoted a report and did not paste a link.
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Here Chris...... 
Re: U.K. Government out of it's mind... 
