I expect simple behaviours here. Friendship, and love. Any advice should be from the perspective of the person asking, not the person giving! We have had to make new membership moderated to combat the huge number of spammers who register
Location: US/Canada
Registered: September 2009
Messages: 733
The BBC's Weekend World program takes a look at the plight of gay Palestinians, some of whom escape torture and imprisonment by fleeing into Israel, only to face deportation back to their side of the fence should they be discovered.
Location: U.S.
Registered: November 2009
Messages: 630
I find it unfortunate that a Palistinian must chose Israel to live or face death at the hand of his own people. I don't blame the government of Israel for wanting to send them back and building a wall around them. We are doing the same thing with Mexico and look what that relationship has done to us.
The actions of Arab peoples against homosexuals puts them in the realm of the Taliban and gives no creedence to their "peaceful intentions at seeking statehood." Another black eye for Islam, they appear to be the religion of choice for the the violent and insane.
If all nations evaluated others based upon human rights then Palistine would be a dismal failure. I don't give a rat's ass who was in the Holy Land first, those claims are irrelevant. To say that the Palistinians deserve a country of their own under Islamic law is to accept that they are willing to be less than human and we agree with it.
The various factions in the Middle East need to understand one thing. If Palistine does ever become a state it will be a short lived victory. Without basic human rights for LGBT people and women in general they are doomed from the start. Islam has become a rallying cry for so many deranged people and all that has done is put them in the gunsights of the rest of us.
To hear that young Palistinian boys are prostituted in Tel Aviv doesn't surpise me, they get treated the same in their country. When the weak are out on the street to survive they will be preyed upon. Israel, Palestine or Los Angeles, it's all the same human cesspool.
Age appears to be best in four things; old wood best to burn, old wine to drink, old friends to trust, and old authors to read. (Sir Francis Bacon 1561-1626)
Location: Israel
Registered: October 2004
Messages: 1367
Thank you, Brody for posting these two clips. The first clip tells a story that is absolutely true - though, thank God, as the reporter tells us in the second clip, it is not typical.
Both the Aguda in Tel-Aviv and the Open House in Jerusalem do all that they can for Palestinian gays. The Open House has a special department for Palestinian gays because those who live in Arab Jerusalem are there legally and cannot be deported anywhere.
As you can imagine, the Israeli authorities keep a very watchful eye on Palestinians in Israel because of the threat of terrorism. Only Palestinians with Israeli work permits are legally allowed to reside in the State of Israel. (I am referring to Palestinians who are not citizens of the State.)
The best thing that can happen for a Palestinian gay man is to find an Israeli partner: permits are almost always granted in such circumstances. Failing that, the Aguda and the Open House, in very difficult cases, try to find a home for the Palestinian gay man in a friendly country. I personally know one man who is now so happy in Sweden that he has applied for Swedish citizenship. (Timmy has an essay that the man wrote about his experiences. Maybe he will make it available to us some day.)
FWIW, I heartily agree with what Chris has written about the situation in Moslem countries.
J F R
The paradox has often been noted that the United States, founded in secularism, is now the most religiose country in Christendom, while England, with an established church headed by its constitutional monarch, is among the least. (Richard Dawkins, 2006)
Location: Israel
Registered: October 2004
Messages: 1367
It's uncanny how things sometimes come in two. As a continuation of this thread I inject a news story from today's Israeli newspapers. It concerns Israeli Arab (Moslem) citizens, not Palestinians. At least this story has a 'happy' ending, but it could have been very, very different.
This story illustrates the social causes of Moslem homophobia in the middle east: what will the neighbours say? what will our relatives say? One man's behaviour reflects on the whole clan, as it were. I wonder whether anything can be done about these social attitudes.
J F R
The paradox has often been noted that the United States, founded in secularism, is now the most religiose country in Christendom, while England, with an established church headed by its constitutional monarch, is among the least. (Richard Dawkins, 2006)
Location: U.S.
Registered: November 2009
Messages: 630
What I see relevant to me is that the Chief of Police made the statement he did villifying the relatives, now that is progress.
Here in the US only about 2/3 of the states address sexual orientation in their hate crimes laws. Until Obama signed the federal laws this past year there was no national mandate to recognize crimes against LGBT people as anything but simple assault.
Israel seems to take their hate crimes laws seriously. Here in the US after an assault on a gay person the first argument is with the prosecutor about if this is a hate crime or not. The bias of many officals still stands in the way of recognizing these crimes for what they are and keeping a record of such events.
As for this young man's family, their embarassment is nothing but interference in his life. Here parents throw a gay child out on the street and get away with it, we need better laws and accountability. If this gay man's family is so sensitive, and that is a clan behavior, then one would think Osama Bin Laden's family ought to be suicidal. They are not, they are rich and don't give a damn.
I have little patience with such Arabs but we will have to deal with them until they run out of bribe money to keep the oil industry in their pockets. I say we need more nuclear power and that all the radioactive waste left over could be dumped in Iran, at least they're not Arabs.
Age appears to be best in four things; old wood best to burn, old wine to drink, old friends to trust, and old authors to read. (Sir Francis Bacon 1561-1626)
Towards the end of the article is a paragraph about Moslem gays. Also, in view of something that Chris said, you might take a look at the first of the talkbacks entit;ed Grindr.
J F R
The paradox has often been noted that the United States, founded in secularism, is now the most religiose country in Christendom, while England, with an established church headed by its constitutional monarch, is among the least. (Richard Dawkins, 2006)
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From The BBC A Look At The Plight Of Gay Palestinians 
Re: From The BBC A Look At The Plight Of Gay Palestinians 
