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Recently a group of friends had a discussion. Someone made the comment that something was SO gay. the inference was not meaning that it was campy but that it was lame, undesirable or however you want to say it.
When it turned into milieu I realized that this is an issue which carries a lot of opinion. So I thought I would share some of those here and gather some of your opinions in comment. So please do voice your opinion, even if it is not popular or congruent with the tone and tenor of this article. Debate is how we refresh our truth.
The content was like this. XZY group is gay. I should also mention that in this conversation most were gay, a couple bi. I mention this because I think it has bearing.
One person spoke up and said, "Please don't say that. It perpetuates a stereotype that we are trying to get away from."
Well that started a very heated debate. Another said that the language being a living language evolved to have a new or different meaning than it did originally. though that definition was never really made clear to me other than to show that something was of lessor desirability.
Now, here are my thoughts on this.
First let me say that the first time I heard the term gay was way back in the 1960's when gays were trying to get away from the terms Queer and Faggot. Homosexual was at that time way too clinical and we were trying to convince the world we were not mentally ill.
So as time went on, I think it was in early 1970's when I heard it used for the first time in a derogatory fashion. As in, "What, are you gay or something?"
It was usually not really a question but an accusation. And later used as trend control by the ones in high schools that try and control public opinion and become powerful. If Mark liked a particular style shoe and he was looking to take some of the attention away from Ken, then Ken would make a comment like, those shoes are so gay. Meaning that only a homosexual would wear those.
Peer pressure being what it is, anybody that didn't want to be painted as queer didn't hang with Mark and didn't ever wear those shoes to school.
Now here is where it gets tricky. To straights, I think that "Gay" has only one meaning. Homosexual. At least subliminally at the very least. But to many of our gay youth, they have become desensitized to the point that they actually use it themselves. And not merely as camouflage.
For instance, someone might look at an out fit and say, Honey I'm not even gay enough to wear that. Or Christ he is so gay. Meaning campy. But it's usage is so casual that it is easy to accept as a non homosexual ding at something. I think we as a community are sometimes our own worst advertising.
I think that it qualifies as hate speech and actually does indeed, whether overtly or subliminally, tie being homosexual to being something undesirable.
Doubt that? Try substituting the word "retard" for gay. It had the same connotation before gay. It referred to a person of diminished capacity. The truly sad part is it was often used in front of such people in a derogatory manner as if they were not aware of the words being said. Having worked with the MR I know all they wanted was to be loved, accepted and left alone. Sound familiar?
It also makes the point that it is indeed a form of hate speech.
I also think it hurts the movement to normalize homosexuality, bisexuality and all the others in the family of non-heterosexuality to society and as long as we perpetuate that stereotype of gay equals lessor quality or being undesirable we will never find the equality we seek for ourselves and all the gays to come after us.
Words mean things and we can't hope to sway society when we ourselves are telling them their current beliefs are correct.
I close with this final thought. the first time I heard it used as a negative I was so deep in the closet that I wished for death rather than someone find out. When I heard that boy say that something was so gay, his meaning was clear, It was something to be hated and avoided.
In my mind I cried these tears, "Please don't hate me. I'm not bad. All I want is someone to love and love me back. If you make them hate me I will always be alone."
Words mean things.
Whether it has evolved or not. I think it's both, hurtful and wrong.
I'm sure there are some of you that will think this whole article is gay.
ADDITIONAL INFORMATION:
The following information has been taken from the Lifeguard workshop in both the elementary and jr. High as well as the High School Curriculum from The Trevor Project. An organization that deals with teen suicides. This is an educational workshop. This excerpt taken from page 8:
Addressing the Impact of our Language and Actions
Ask the students to brainstorm a list of all the terms they have heard, used and can think of to describe people who identify as lesbian, gay, bisexual, and transgender(and write all the terms on the board). It is okay and should be encouraged here for them to list negative terms as well—this will make the discussion questions more valuable.
After they have completed shouting out words, ask them then to go back and circle all of the words that can be used “offensively” or “to hurt someone.” The likely result is that nearly all or all of the words will be circled. Follow-up questions include:
How would someone who identifies as LGBTQ feel knowing that nearly every word used to describe them can also be used to hurt them?
1. Have you ever used or heard the phrase, “That’s so gay?” What do you think is meant by that phrase? How do you think someone who is LGBTQ
2. would feel if they heard someone say that?
Do you think that is why there are LGBTQ people right here at your school who are too scared to come out? How would someone who identifies as or
3. is perceived to be LGBTQ be treated here at your school?
Are there any other groups you can think of where nearly every word used to describe them is also hurtful? If so, what groups?
4. What do you think the outcomes of all this negative language are on the feelings and thoughts of (young) people who identify as LGBTQ?
5. In response to this discussion question, it is likely that participants will identify feelings such as “sad,” “depressed,” “anxious,” or even “suicidal.” Use these feelings they name as a bridge from helping them understand the impact of their language and actions into a discussion of suicide. The first goal of the workshop has been met when participants have begun to examine how language (including stereotyping and assumptions) can impact a young LGBTQ person’s self-esteem and well-being, and lead to depression and suicidal thoughts, feelings and behaviors.
These workshops are free and may be found:
The Trevor Project
http://www.thetrevorproject.org/
Wisdom does not come with age. It occurs because of it.
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13796
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I have challenges with words, per se, being imbued with demonic properties. I am far more concerned with context.
I dislike the schoolyard "That's so gay!" comment when used as a casual insult, or when it is used unthinkingly. If used correctly I have no issue with it.
There are lists of words disliked by many segments of society. A simple list includes words such as:- cunt
- fuck
- fag
- nigger
- negro
- poof/pouf
but all depend on context.
'You fucking cunt!' can even be used as an endearment!
Look up Richard Pryor for some serious and wholly acceptable use of 'nigger'
So we have to be careful when we criticise the word choice of someone else. But we may only criticise things when we see the context.
Some time ago one of our number objected here to the word 'Brit' showing reasons that are logical for finding the word offensive, yet I believe he disregarded context. Otherwise how would 'The Brit Awards" ever have been socially acceptable?
I'm absolutely in favour of objecting to usage and deployment of words and phrases, but I will not imbue any word with a particular worth. A cunt is, after all, an anatomical part of a female. It isn't anything special. I fail to understand why women especially find the word offensive.
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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Probably for the same reasons some of us get upset at the words fag and faggot. It's the context that most often determines if it's offensive or neutral.
That being said, I tend to choose my own words carefully as well. It's often not what you say, but how you say it, when you say it and why you say it that conveys plurality of meaning.
It's not the wolf you see you should fear, but all the ones he howls with. Don't be afraid of the song, but don't piss off the choir.
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13796
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"Can I bum a fag off you?"
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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Actually, no, since I don't smoke. ;-D
It's not the wolf you see you should fear, but all the ones he howls with. Don't be afraid of the song, but don't piss off the choir.
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13796
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Which brings me right back to context.
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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ROTFLMAO!
Well said Tim.
Wisdom does not come with age. It occurs because of it.
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Sure, how 'bout that guy over there. Hey, can I smoke you bum?
Wisdom does not come with age. It occurs because of it.
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I understand your sentiments Tim but respectfully think that in this case it is different. And Tim, you are a journalist. If anyone here should know that words mean things, it's a skilled wordsmith like you.
Regarding Richard Prior, He's a comedian, it would be like using George Carlin for factual data on fidelity or sobriety.
I grew up in the black ghetto and their word for each other is nigga. And that is when they use it amongst themselves. Used by any other race and it's more than a fight.
And a cunt is a derogatory term for a female and although through slang, it is considered by some of the less refined, as an alternative term for vagina. But I don't think Gray's Anatomy lists it in their table of contents or index.
Fag, poof, queer, uphill farmer, fudge packer and any of the rest of those wonderful feel good epitaphs that Rev Phillips and his ilk use are all derogatory and hurtful and hateful and foster ill feelings of social unacceptability to anyone who hears them. They diminish the self-worth of those they are directed at as well as those that indirectly receive them.
In short, regardless of the context or direction of intent. Were they overheard by a youth that is representative of the euphemism,will cause them to be scared, hurt, terrified, ostracized, pushed back into the closet or into hiding or possibly even cause them sufficient sadness and depression that they become suicidal.
We all know of people who have been so verbally abused by being told they are worthless, dirty or bad, to the point that they start believing it. But that is usually done by a single person. A spouse or parent. Imagine now being isolated in society, having new hormones raging and getting, "You are worthless, you are bad, you are what we compare undesirable things to to determine if they deserve life, and you get it from MULTIPLE people.
Christ, no wonder we have so many teenage suicides.
Just like it is ok for the blacks to use Nigga/nigger amongst themselves as they themselves are culturally desensitized to it. I fear, so to have we as a gay culture done the same.
And thank you for proving my point. Just as you have derived or deduced that since they [The African Culture] uses nigga/nigger amongst themselves, that it is permissible or acceptable for you to use it yourself, So to has the gay culture given the straight society the impression that they can make us a subhuman species of us through their use of the word gay as a negative comparative expletive.
So for ME, regardless of the context, whether overtly or subliminally, negative comparative expletives hurt us as descent citizens, stewards of society and caring family to our brothers and sister yet to come, it is not just wrong, but shameful if we continue it and endorse its acceptability in any way shape or form.
Definitely one of those, what is right is not always popular and what is popular is not always right scenarios.
(Does this mean I get the boot?) :-/
Wisdom does not come with age. It occurs because of it.
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13796
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Ah, but I'm not a journalist 
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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It's not alright if this is SO Gay! 
...said philosophically and without any malice.... 
Re: ...said philosophically and without any malice.... 
Re: It's not alright if this is SO Gay! 
