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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13751
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If so, please go away. No-one wants you here. Go to a gay dating site. But quite simply get off this one.
I am talking currently to Jamie about the forum. He says:
it used to be full of friendly fun people, but now it's just people pontificating.
I guess its that you think they acvtually CARE whatother sthink and what YOU think. they don't
alot of old men blabbering
they are lonely and bored
they don't have a life like you do
and they sure don't have one like mine
your MB ios to help young people and men who are afraid. this is not happening
it would never have helped me if I had come there today.
Jamie wonders why I don't close it down. He has heard me wonder whether I should do so many, many times. He understands that I am very close to making that decision today.
So let me tell you something. If I even suspect you are just here because you love the sound of your own voice, you are HISTORY. I already perceive that about several of you. Better change my perception. If you fail you will find that posting privileges vanish. There is no appeal.
You need to add something of value here for scared gay kids and the adults they become.
If you are just lonely, this forum is not for you, so go here: http://www.megamatesmen.com/
[Updated on: Fri, 03 September 2010 22:54]
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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Benji
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Likes it here |
Location: USA
Registered: August 2007
Messages: 297
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Actually, I come here every so often to read the posts on topics I don't to hear in the states. I especially love reading post's by a certain poster here. I'm a moderator on another site, but I check and read here daily, I don't always respond, and especially if it looks like a flame war is in progress, I avoid the topic sadly. Now, am I lonely and bored? Good question! But I'm busy enough to know I'm not bored and I'm not lonely either. I do hope you keep the site active Timmy, have you ever thought of adding a teen thread so the teens can talk on their own, without the older generation (as you noted) upsetting the apple cart? Either way I'd hate to see your site disappear. Thanks, for many great topics you're site has given me from the other side of the pond!
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ray2x
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Really getting into it |
Location: USA
Registered: April 2009
Messages: 429
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There are married gay men here and I thought I was the only one on earth. Too, there are traditional gay men and boys. Lonely? Hardly! Old? Maybe but not feeling old! Just keep the site alive and I'll be on as much as I can.
Raymundo
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I suppose that this is a reasonable question to ask of me, or any of the aging regulars.
I came initially near as I can recall about 10-years ago because of "Chris and Nigel". I signed your guest-book, took a good look around your entire web-site, and found this, "A Place Of Safety", signed in and made friends.
That I've remained is a testament to the solidarity and fellowship you, Timmy, have fostered through this most worthy and valuable endeavour, not just to the gay and lesbian youth that were so prevalent here back then; but too, to the many early and late middle-aged gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgendered gentle folk who gathered here; and gather they did, and have, and apparently continue to do so, not just in time of anguish, but too in times of great joy, and just as often as not sometimes in sorrow.
I have my charitable work which keeps me busy three and now sometimes four days a week, this over and above the refurbishing of computers for those who can't afford them through two local agencies. I have my two sons, and two nieces who think I'm the cat's pajamas; but still and all I make time to return here often daily, but never less than once every three or four days, in the expectation that there may be someone ... anyone ... in distress that might benefit from something I may be able to impart through joining in on their discussion. Sadly, this is very few and far between the case anymore; but, the friendship and the fellowship remains; and I would miss that dearly should this sanctuary cease to exist.
Too, perhaps I've shared far too much of myself here; but, if I have it was simply to illustrate through my sharing these details that there is hope, there is a life not filled with anguish and despair, that it is possible to live an "Out" and reasonable well adjusted Gay Life, and survive the day-to-day hurdles thrown at each and everyone of us by an often cruel and unsympathetic society. Being Gay or Lesbian, or Bisexual, or Transgendered does not have to be perpetually miserable. There are many of us who have walked the walk, talked the talk, and paraded gloriously down that boulevard of broken dreams, and come out the other side whole, healthy and in harmony with those around us.
Warren C. E. Austin
The Gay Deceiver
Toronto, Canada
"... comme recherché qu'un délice callipygian"
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13751
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That is one of the purposes of this forum as it stands. ANother forum stream is not impossile, but it was not the initial design thought.
[Updated on: Sat, 04 September 2010 08:48]
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13751
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That is one of the purposes of this forum as it stands.
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13751
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That is one of the purposes of this forum as it stands.
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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saben
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On fire! |
Registered: May 2003
Messages: 1537
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You might as well close it down, then.
Because if you remove posting privileges for those that come here to "pontificate" it'll pretty soon just be a ghost town anyway with most of the members gone. The main appeal of this place as it has been for the last 3-4 years has been having somewhat intellectual discussions with no topic being taboo.
You're not going to lure teens that are in pain back here just by willing it, nor by killing off the current community. Communities change and if anything you should be adapting the website and forum to suit the current members rather than pushing current members away in the hope that you're ideal demographic will decide to start visiting instead.
If you really want a website that you can use to help gay teens then you need a new one. This website is dated and technological and social paradigms have changed. What appealed about this website to me, to Jamie, to Ashley, to Andy, to Angel, to Garret, to Aden, etc doesn't seem to be appealing to the youth of today.
Part of it is also that there's no longer a "critical mass" of other youth. When I came here if it was just older guys and no other teens I'd have been put off. But there was multiple other teens I could talk to. As current members have grown older and less new people (of all ages) have joined the forum the average age has just increased. So less youngsters will stick around because it's an "old people's forum".
Not to mention technological changes (from forums to web 2.0- and from nifty stories to just porn), social changes (so less kids need as much help and those that do need it often can rely on friends and family more).
But kill off the current community if you want (through closing it or banning verbose members). Just don't expect the kids to come flooding back in if you do.
Look at this tree. I cannot make it blossom when it suits me nor make it bear fruit before its time [...] No matter what you do, that seed will grow to be a peach tree. You may wish for an apple or an orange, but you will get a peach.
Master Oogway
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Warren wrote: "Being Gay or Lesbian, or Bisexual, or Transgendered does not have to be perpetually miserable..." Nope, it does not at all.
That's the entire point of a good deal of the articles that I publish here at Tim's.
But... I also bring news to the attention of the members here for their perusal, edification, discussion and in the case of Op-Eds, their agreement or disagreement.
I am NOT qualified to advise youth, or oldsters, with deep personal problems nor would I pretend to be so or do so. I feel that is very inappropriate behaviour as I am a journalist, that's it. I even defer to experts as I've found that's a by far wiser choice and as a result I have a list of organisations that cater to those personal needs listed on my blogsite.
Recently, in fact VERY recently, one of the young Russian University students who frequent my home came to me with tears in his eyes. I asked him what was wrong, and he told me after a significant amount of 'beating around the proverbial bush' that he had come to the realisation that he was Gay.
I must note, that all of these students are told that I am Gay and I do not hide from who I am...now, beings how these kids are from a seriously homophobic set of cultures as I also have a group of Ukrainian students as well, [ the common language obviously being Russian,] it is interesting to note that none of them react negatively especially once they've gotten to know me. Now, in the only three or four years that I have been actively participating as an adviser to the United Work & Travel Programme folk for those two countries, I have yet to encounter a virulent reaction to my advising them that I am Gay.
Back to this young man, he was and still is VERY frightened and worse he is from a city in the southern part of Russia that quite frankly would be analogous in attitudes to say Mobile, Alabama. He had a girlfriend, with whom he has had a relationship for nearly three years now, and had even brought her with on the Work-Travel-Study last year as well as this year.
He is torn up because he has been living the lie... With Her, His folks, his friends. Which, I can only too well relate to as I also had lived it for many years. He is undergoing a transformation, akin to a caterpillar emerging as a butterfly... and it is so hard for him.
I tell you this NOT to puff up my self-importance nor to illustrate that I am a good guy, that's NOT the point. My point is that I do understand exactly what Tim has here on this forum.
However, I am only providing a service of much needed information and it angers me when I get sniped at for providing it. Oh and the 'we can get our news elsewhere' is to be lame as beneath my consideration.
Some of you miss the bloody point, EACH of us brings a unique talent and VOICE, and some of what I have read here, I passed along to that young Russian so that he can see that he's NOT alone.
The young man has been reading Tim's forum and its archives and was upset that I was under attack, I told him that I've pretty broad shoulders & I didn't care as honestly, my advocacy and contributions to the greater LGBT community are such that its easier to just be 'acerbic tongued' as I am comfortable with who, what, and how I am as a man who also happens to be Gay.
I'm actually on the phone with him now and he said to let all of you know that even though things may change, even places like this are still relevant. His name is Ryat and here's a pic shot a few days ago outside my flat published here with his permission and when he gets better situated you will have a chance to meet with him as he has told me he will join.
He's only 21 and just getting started... He is the reason I 'campaign' with the vicious rubbish as one of you wrote.... maybe you don't like my style, but then again, the truth is I don't care.
I'm here to contribute using my skills... MY voice.... MY perspective... And I shall remain until Tim says go.
Photo of Ryat By Brody Levesque
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Attachment: Ryat.jpg
(Size: 67.58KB, Downloaded 429 times)
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13751
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This is the first, I think, piece of who YOU are, Brody. It comes out as you tell this simple story.
I would venture to suggest that others feel a need to touch the man when reading his posts.
This post among others is what this forum is for
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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Am I just here because I am are lonely and bored?
Not at the moment, certainly.
I originally came here (via the Story Shelf) at a rather low point in my life. I'd recently become disabled and had to take early retirement, had several days a week when I was housebound, and was working through several decades-worth of stuff that I'd to some extent been avoiding by immersing myself in work. Yup, I was seeing a therapist every week (for six months), dealing with becoming disabled, with the emotional issues surrounding not having been on speaking terms ith my father for 20 years, and with my first, teenaged, rather abusive, sexual relationship many years ago. The support I recieved here was very helpful to me, and I tried to give back in kind.
I stayed because of the friendships that developed, because of mutual respect among equals, and because of the unusal degree of openness and honesty of some of the posters here. I shared a fir bit about myself, as well. And part of that sharing was thiungs that I feel passionately about, and where there have been things that other people could do or join in to further things hat are important to me and others (I've never been one for just publicising things with no guide as to why they might be important,or how anyone else can help make a difference: I think it gives an unfortunate impression of powerlessness). These have largely been "gay-type" issues: World AIDS day red ribbons, the inhuman treatment of a lad called "Zack", and more specifc UK-based stuff like the Ruth Kelly threat to the Sexual Orientation Regulations part of the Equalites Act, UK blood donations, etc. I've shared good times to encourage others (such as my experiences of assorted Pride Londons), and bad.
More recently, I've occasionally posted here, but mostly on my blog, about the frustrating and difficult, but joyous and deeply rewarding time I'm having with the teenaged ex-street-kid ex-junkie who is now such a central part of my life (new readers start here: http://forum.iomfats.org/w-agora/index.php?site=forumiomfatsorg&bn=forumiomfatsorg_placeofsafety&key=1269526327&action=view , then read the blog starting about here http://www.nickweeks.net/blogging/index.php/2010/03/12/ . I have been tremendously buoyed up by all the warm and supportive blog comments and private emails and other things that have come from both posters and lurkers here: it truly has been one of the things that's kept me going during some difficult times.
But I have to recognise that I've grown in one direction, and the forum here has grown very much in another. So, for now at least, I have to remain "a former regular poster".
"The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral, begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy. ... Returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night devoid of stars." Martin Luther King
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For me there are not enough hours in the day to become either bored or lonely.
I make it a point of personal discipline to come here every day and keep up with the lives and thoughts of my cyber-friends.
Hugs
Nigel
I dream of boys with big bulges in their trousers,
Never of girls with big bulges in their blouses.
…and look forward to meeting you in Cóito.
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... of the sense of alienation you have been, and must now be, feeling with regard to the Forum. For a short while, a goodly number of years ago, I too had a parallel identity here at A Place Of Safety; one in which I sought refuge (as Timmy most assuredly knew) because of the hurt I felt due to the savagery of some comments directed to myself, and to those close to me here. With time, these issues resolved themselves and I was able to return to my now ubiquitous soubriquet.
What I failed to understand then (and Timmy tried to counsel me thus), was that like any "Family", squabbles do tend erupt amongst siblings, and that collegial fellowship will, and does, generally survive these tests of endurance in the absence of any sensible equanimity. I, to this day, have no idea whether any of the posts I made using that nom de plume survived, or whether its' even registered here anymore (I haven't cared enough to look); but, I do know that the one and only Haiku I ever penned does, and it fairly rises to the top with some frequency, it in of itself being a singular legacy of that turbulent time in my personal growth here at A Place Of Safety.
Your reasoned voice, like that of many dissenters here, is essential to well-balance dialogue, and we all suffer equally should any compassioned discourse ever be silenced. Return to us in your own good time friend; but, return you eventually must. Help heal what collectively ails us.
Warren C. E. Austin
The Gay Deceiver
Toronto, Canada
"... comme recherché qu'un délice callipygian"
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13751
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Forgive me for one quibble. The word 'must', for there is no duty to return. One may return and may contribute, or one may stay away. That you would like him to return is evident. All else that you say I agree with.
One cannot influence something by an absence. Only by making a positive contribution can one expect to have success.
Your old posts survive. You can search for posts made by that username.
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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I simply had no idea that you ever read any of my posts. I'm heartened to learn that you do.
Brody, I perceive that it is not so much the nature of the stories and features you bring to the Forum which causes the friction you see evidenced by a goodly number of responses to them; but, rather (as I've pointed out in another thread here) the manner in which you present them for our consideration.
That you are a good man has never been in doubt in my mind; how it could ever be otherwise, to any rational person had they ever visited your blog is in of itself questionable; granted, and especially, if over time as I have done, each had followed the thrust of your thinking, the causes that have merited your attention, and the concerns you have had, and continue to have, for the human condition.
Too, I understand the underlying cause of the frustration, and impatience, that you and your fellow, and like-minded, journalist brethren feel towards any dissembling on the part of persons when presented with the stories and features you share and bring to any table. It is taking too long, far too long, to effect the change that you and I both know must come, not just from within American society but World society, and not just specifically LGBTQ issues either. Canada, The Nederlands, Danmark, and a few others may have been the torch bearers, the early adopters if you will; but, it has been a long and arduous journey; none that has been fully realized, with all continuing to be a work in progress. That the U.S.A. and the U.K. have joined this growing community whereby equality of all and where diversity is being fully recognized as our only hope for the survival of the human condition is laudable considering that it is a time whose time has come, and none too soon at that. Kindly remember that in your adopted country, emancipation may have been the Law of the Land for more than 150 years, but, in reality it has only been some 50-years that any real change within the core of the American fabric has truly been seen to be done in that direction; similarly, whilst the Wilberforce Declaration of the early 1830's may well have put paid to odious and most questionable practices within the then Empire, it wouldn't be until the Brixton Riots in the late 1960's, and the immigration crisis of the 1980's that equality would become even a tattered reality within British society. True societal, and moral, change takes generations; it takes concerted action by all parties at the table to effect that change; Laws enacted will never be, nor are they ever, enough; it being the province of "balanced and reasoned" Education to see all done right by changing times; exclusion, regardless of the parameters established for its' governance, is never, ever, going to bring about true equality anywhere for anyone. An apple is still only an apple, regardless of its' being a Golden Delicious, or MacIntosh, or Spy; an orange is still only an orange regardless of its' being a Sunkist, or a Tangerine, or a Mandarin; each being simply varieties of the same, with none better than the other, none more or less equal, and certainly none more or less worthy of our consideration. So too, it is with the human condition, despite its' foibles, frailties, and its' strengths and weaknesses; we all deserve equal treatment in one an others eyes, and until that day is realized, your voice, and the voices of all humankind deserve to be equally heard.
Please, simply find a less confrontation voice with which to enlighten us. The most fragile amongst the membership here (and they may not yet even know who they are) do not react well to aggressive behaviours, be that either yours, or mine, or anyone's.
Warren C. E. Austin
The Gay Deceiver
Toronto, Canada
[Updated on: Sun, 05 September 2010 16:39]
"... comme recherché qu'un délice callipygian"
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saben
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On fire! |
Registered: May 2003
Messages: 1537
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"I am NOT qualified to advise youth, or oldsters, with deep personal problems nor would I pretend to be so or do so. I feel that is very inappropriate behaviour as I am a journalist, that's it. I even defer to experts as I've found that's a by far wiser choice and as a result I have a list of organisations that cater to those personal needs listed on my blogsite."
The whole point of this forum is that none of us are qualified and that has never mattered. People could feel comfortable here without it being a matter of profession. We'd all be able to offer our unique perspectives and amongst that plurality of perspectives and opinions the people that need advice or help may find something that resonates with them.
You being a journalist doesn't make you any less able to have an opinion or experience that could help others. You have the opportunity to help Ryat and people like him in real-life content. I'm sure you don't try and help him by linking him to a bunch of websites or journalistic media about being gay and why he needs to support transsexuals. So I'm not sure why you do that here.
Think of the fragility of Ryat when he first told you. And how you had to be careful to make him feel comfortable and accepted. That is the atmosphere that people here want to generate. Heavy campaigning runs counter to that atmosphere.
This is an online forum that has been for those too scared to ever tell anyone in real life. It's been a forum for discussing the deepest, darkest secrets. But it's not really any more. Partially because there's little new blood and those of us here have already helped each other through issues. But partially because the atmosphere has changed.
I don't come here for campaigning and I don't really come here for help any more. The Saben of today is different to the Saben of 16-17 that first came here. I still come partially out of habit and partially because it's still somewhere I feel I can engage in no-topics taboo intellectual debate. I haven't been coming as much though, because it's been losing interest. Because the campaign heavy stuff isn't what I come here for, it never has been.
This website if it is going to continue trying to reach out to other likes Ryat is probably going to need to undergo some changes. But I definitely still don't think killing off the discussions that we've had here in the past or killing off the current community is the way to go. I don't know that this will necessarily ever be a place that appeals to younger people again or not. But that shouldn't strictly speaking matter. But it was intended to be a place of safety and a place for help and advice. A group of friends, or even a family that could depend on each other.
Look at this tree. I cannot make it blossom when it suits me nor make it bear fruit before its time [...] No matter what you do, that seed will grow to be a peach tree. You may wish for an apple or an orange, but you will get a peach.
Master Oogway
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13751
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For the first time in a very long time I think I agree with almost everything you have said.
The internet may have moved on, you know. That may be one of the reasons why teens are absent.
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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I'm on the mailing list, and I saw the notice about the poll. So I hit the site and dutifully voted accordingly - choice seven.
Then, since I was here already I was just going to post a link to a funny picture I saw on the interwebs to maybe cheer someone up, and make a small note about the hilariousness sometimes arising from the dichotomy in human nature between shallowness in some young individuals and the weird humor in others. This to maybe make me forget the glum reality of my pointless life for just a short while.
Then I saw this post, which was the reason I suspect for the poll being posted up.
I wanted to say something about the wisdom in not making posts (or rash decisions of any kind) in anger - because it feels like an angry post - but hell, who am I to give anyone advice.
Now...well, why bother. Funny pictures? Useless frivolities in the face of a cold, uncaring reality.
Yes, I'm old - or at least that's the way I feel inside - and I'm bored, frightfully bored with my life, or the tiny useless excuse of one that I have, and it's true this isn't the same place it used to be...although nothing ever is.
Everything is in constant change, like the universe itself. The motion of all matter, expanding outwards from a single point at the moment of the big bang, is according to current understanding, accelerating. At some point in time in the far future our galaxy will not just drift away from all other galaxies surrounding us, but the forces of universal expansion will overcome the sum of the galaxy's gravity, and the stars in our galaxy itself will start to drift away from each other. The Milky Way will break up, dissolve, like a fizzy tablet dropped in a glass of water. The speed of expansion of the stars surrounding us - if any still burn at this far-flung point in time - will eventually become so great that even light will not be able to reach us. The stars of the sky will appear to wink out, one by one, as the combined sum of motion of our respective bodies accelerates past C, and our nightly heavens will go completely dark. It will be as if there is nothing else out there but ourselves, if any humans are still alive to witness these events, over a thousand billion years from now.
In the final gasping moments of the universe, gravity will be overcome completely. Stars, planets, moons...everything will break apart, flying outwards as individual atoms. Even mighty supermassive black holes, the centers of large galaxies, will be forced to give up their treasures of mass; turning inside-out one might say I suppose. Everything expanding, ever expanding. And then the atoms themselves will break apart in their constituent parts and there will essentially be nothing left. Nothing that says we ever existed, every thing and every trace we left behind will be...nothing. Not even dust.
Yes, everything changes. Hoping for things to revert to like they always used to be is usually less than wishful thinking, because "the good old days" were never really as good as they seem in our memories.
We can only accept the change, try to make the best of it. Try to steer it in a useful, productive direction instead of attempting to fight it. ...Because the change will come, regardless of what we do, or don't.
...But you're right. This is not a place of safety anymore. I don't think I shall be returning here again, I wouldn't want to risk being caught pontificating or anything, now knowing the consequences of that.
"But he that hath the steerage of my course,
direct my sail."
-William Shakespeare, Romeo and Juliet, Act One, Scene IV
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... about this.
Thank you Lenny for drawing this to my attention; and very likely that of others here aw well.
I've followed the link to "Visit my Home on the Web" at top centre of the Forum Welcome page, and voted; but, I otherwise would not have ever known about it.
Keep you chin up dude! Things are going to be improving around here; you'll see.
Warren C. E. Austin
The Gay Deceiver
Toronto, Canada
"... comme recherché qu'un délice callipygian"
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13751
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I am not at all concerned about any regular poster's answers in the poll which is why I have not publicised it here. It is addressed to those who visit the site as a whole, and is intended to discover things about the use of forums, not necessarily as constituted here.
Most important is that no conclusions can yet be drawn from it. It has not run for long enough, and the answer population does not yet remain broadly constant. It is likely to become useful after the weekend.
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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Are you just here because you are lonely and bored? 
Re: Am I here just because I am lonely and bored? 
