A Place of Safety
I expect simple behaviours here. Friendship, and love.
Any advice should be from the perspective of the person asking, not the person giving!
We have had to make new membership moderated to combat the huge number of spammers who register
















You are here: Home > Forum > A Place of Safety > General Talk > Is it possible?!
icon5.gif Is it possible?!  [message #66979] Wed, 05 September 2012 21:00 Go to next message
Lachezar is currently offline  Lachezar   Macedonia

Getting started

Registered: September 2012
Messages: 3



I am a teenager from Bulgaria. We don't have sexual education classes. So I have been searching the internet for a pretty long time and I am so happy i found this wonderful forum. I am full of questions but the one that has been bodering me for a long time is the following: Can a person get HIV infected if he never was sexually active? I am looking forward to your answer. Thank you
Re: Is it possible?!  [message #66980 is a reply to message #66979] Wed, 05 September 2012 21:10 Go to previous messageGo to next message
timmy   United Kingdom

Has no life at all
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13515



There are only two ways to become HIV+
  1. Contact with infected body fluids
  2. Be born to a mother who is already HIV+

Blood transfusion from an infected person, or an injury from a syringe needle used by an infected person are the only real ways a person who is not sexually active can become HIV+ form body fluids. So my answer is that there is a very small possibility of becoming infected without having sex, but this possibility does not happen in normal life.

Tell me why this is worrying you? What has happened to make you worry?



Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
Re: Is it possible?!  [message #66981 is a reply to message #66980] Fri, 07 September 2012 21:57 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Simon Peterson is currently offline  Simon Peterson   United Kingdom

Getting started

Registered: September 2012
Messages: 1



The main non-sexual means of transmission are by sharing of needles by drug adicts, birth of children to HIV+ mothers - as Timmy says.

Also possible and there have been cases: infected blood transfusions, organ transplant, body piercing, tattoos, breast feeding.

Unprotected sex is the main way though, anal sex is highest risk due to increased risk of bleeding during it. Oral sex is not risk free either.

Link for further information

http://www.nhs.uk/conditions/HIV/Pages/Introduction.aspx

Re: Is it possible?!  [message #66982 is a reply to message #66981] Fri, 07 September 2012 22:05 Go to previous messageGo to next message
timmy   United Kingdom

Has no life at all
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13515



"Simon Peterson wrote on Fri, 07 September 2012 22:57"

[...] anal sex is highest risk due to increased risk of bleeding during it. [...]



I was surprised to learn that unprotected anal penetrative sex can lead to infection even if there is no bleeding. It seems that the walks of the rectum and area just north of it are designed to continue the digestion process, and this means that infective agents may also pass through intact walls and itno the bloodstream of the 'about to be infected' person.

Anal sex is a high risk activity even if one is careful about ensuring no bleeding takes place. All it requires is the depositing of infective agent in body fluids into the rectum and infection becomes possible. All bleeding does is increase the probability of infection.

[Updated on: Fri, 07 September 2012 22:05]




Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
Re: Is it possible?!  [message #66983 is a reply to message #66982] Sat, 08 September 2012 09:45 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kitzyma is currently offline  Kitzyma   United Kingdom

Likes it here

Registered: March 2012
Messages: 215



Quote:
timmy wrote on Fri, 07 September 2012 22:05
Quote:
I was surprised to learn that unprotected anal penetrative sex can lead to infection even if there is no bleeding. It seems that the walks of the rectum and area just north of it are designed to continue the digestion process, and this means that infective agents may also pass through intact walls and itno the bloodstream of the 'about to be infected' person.


--

Absorption from the rectal area is different from that higher in the intestines in that blood from the rectal area it does not go via the liver but directly into the systemic blood supply. As well as metabolising chemicals absorbed into the blood, the liver also contains lots of immune system cells. 

So anything absorbed by the rectum will not be broken down or detoxified before getting into the general blood circulation. This is one reason why some drugs are best administered via suppositories. Thus those people who put alcoholic drinks in their rectum (yes, I've see this reported!!) have a high risk of alcohol poisoning.

Similarly, any virus taken up by the rectum will not be filtered first through the liver's immune system. Thus, in the absence of any bleeding, HIV entering the body via the rectum is probably more likely to lead to infection than HIV entering orally.
Re: Is it possible?!  [message #66989 is a reply to message #66983] Mon, 10 September 2012 07:16 Go to previous messageGo to next message
dgt224 is currently offline  dgt224   United States

Toe is in the water
Location: USA
Registered: May 2011
Messages: 81



Quote:
Kitzyma wrote on Sat, 08 September 2012 05:45
Absorption from the rectal area is different from that higher in the intestines in that blood from the rectal area it does not go via the liver but directly into the systemic blood supply. As well as metabolising chemicals absorbed into the blood, the liver also contains lots of immune system cells. 

So anything absorbed by the rectum will not be broken down or detoxified before getting into the general blood circulation. This is one reason why some drugs are best administered via suppositories. Thus those people who put alcoholic drinks in their rectum (yes, I've see this reported!!) have a high risk of alcohol poisoning.

--
While the above is largely accurate (only the lower 2/3 of the rectum is drained by the internal iliac vein, which bypasses the liver), I suspect that the much more rapid absorption of alcohol through the walls of the rectum and colon than through the esophagus and stomach are a significantly greater source of the risk of alcohol poisoning when alcohol is administered rectally. A significant additional argument for the importance of rapid absorption, rather than liver bypassing, is that the amount of blood flowing through the liver adds up to the total volume of blood in the body every four or five minutes (when at rest), which suggests that chemicals in the blood that don't pass through the liver initially will get there fairly quickly, if they aren't captured by other parts of the body (or manage to infiltrate other parts of the body, in the case of disease organisms) first.

An interesting 2010 study from Australia came up with per-contact probabilities for HIV transmission for unprotected anal intercourse of 1.43% for the receptive partner with ejaculation in the rectum, 0.65% for the receptive partner with withdrawal prior to ejaculation, 0.62% for uncircumcised insertive partners, and 0.11% for circumcised insertive partners. (The authors expressed considerable surprise at the high level of risk for uncircumcised insertive partners.) The transmission rate for circumcised insertive partners was essentially the same as that generally estimated for heterosexual intercourse, which strongly suggests that the rectum really is an effective transmitter of HIV, in both directions.
Re: Is it possible?!  [message #66990 is a reply to message #66989] Mon, 10 September 2012 09:16 Go to previous messageGo to next message
timmy   United Kingdom

Has no life at all
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13515



I do just want to come back to our original questioner. Nothing in what you have read says it is easy to become HIV+ without having sex. Modern blood transfusion is well checked, and we assume that to be the case in Bulgaria, too. Needle sharing with an HIV+ friend is possible, but you have to be insane to share a needle. It does not leap off toilet seats to infect you. So your risks in day to day life without sex are low, low enough to be insignificant. If you are travelling to the third world, however, take extra precautions. Take your own pack of sterile "sharps" with you.

With sex the risks rise based upon the number of partners you have. This is because you increase the probability of having sex with an infected person, not for any other reason. And this is the reason you should only ever have protected sex until you are sure of the other perosn's sexual history AND they have been tested clear for six faithful months. If you are not a virgin and you meet a new partner, even if you are sure of your HIV status it is good manners to have the test along with them. Never ask someone to do something you will not do yourself.



Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
Re: Is it possible?!  [message #67000 is a reply to message #66990] Sat, 15 September 2012 23:01 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Lachezar is currently offline  Lachezar   Macedonia

Getting started

Registered: September 2012
Messages: 3



I am really happy that i got your answers. And you asked me what was the first reason that made me think about this thing. Well for a very long period of time I felt really exhausted, tired, always sleppy during the day. There was always present that big lack of energy, energy that every teenager should have. Then two weeks ago I was reading a book which title is " I am a Teenager - for boys " . and in it there were all sorts of things like things about health, hygiene, finding the appropriate job for yourself , love, sex and so on. But there was one segmenet about HIV. Right there were listed some sy,ptoms of a person that is HIV+. One of them was lack of energy. That made me search the internet and i found out more symptoms. About one week ago, out of nowhere, all of a sudden, on a couple of places on my skin i get something like bumps which are very itchy. That was another symptom which i read about on the net. So i got scared cause I am only  16, i have never had sex with anyone. Now i think that you should know the following: Before I even found this site, i did the things you have written about in the self exploration segment(fingers and candles) and as lubrication I used some a moisturising cream for dry hands by AVON(if you know what AVON is Very Happy). I dont know if that has anything to do with all od this. Remember that book i told you about - I am a teenager. The last sentence of the HIV segment was: if you get any of the symptoms listed above, even if you didnt have sex, visit a doctor. so that i my story . hope i get another answer . thank you so much
Re: Is it possible?!  [message #67001 is a reply to message #67000] Sun, 16 September 2012 08:02 Go to previous messageGo to next message
timmy   United Kingdom

Has no life at all
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13515



Quote:
Lachezar wrote on Sun, 16 September 2012 00:01The last sentence of the HIV segment was: if you get any of the symptoms listed above, even if you didnt have sex, visit a doctor. so that i my story . hope i get another answer . thank you so much

That sentence is very good advice. There are many things that can cause symptoms like that. There is no need to tell the doctor about the things you have tried unless you feel it is important to do so, but you should take these worries to your doctor.

Self exploration will not give you any form of illness. Use of candles will not, unless the candle is contaminated. If the candle is your own candle, used by no-one else, then you have no problem. Avon cosmetics will not give you any form of illness, again unless they have been contaminated.

Lack of energy may be caused by many things, so may itchy bumps. And you are worried. So take the worries to the doctor. It is enough to worry you, so you should go and get a medical opinion. Nothing you have described here will have made you HIV+.



Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
Re: Is it possible?!  [message #67002 is a reply to message #67001] Sun, 16 September 2012 08:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Nigel is currently offline  Nigel   United Kingdom

On fire!
Location: England
Registered: November 2003
Messages: 1756



You might keep M E (Myalgic Encephalopathy) [Chronic Fatigue Syndrome] in the back of your mind.  I'm not saying that is what you have, but some doctors still don't acknowledge it as an illness.

Hugs
Nigel



I dream of boys with big bulges in their trousers,
Never of girls with big bulges in their blouses.

…and look forward to meeting you in Cóito.
Re: Is it possible?!  [message #67004 is a reply to message #67002] Sun, 16 September 2012 10:03 Go to previous messageGo to next message
timmy   United Kingdom

Has no life at all
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13515



True, that Smile I remember having extreme lethargy after a simple viral illness. It took about 6 months to shake off, coupled with a good physician who explored all possibilities. I went from being happy to walk for a couple of hours or more to being exhausted after 200 metres. Something was obviously wrong, but no-one could quite say what.

At present, though, the main thing our young friend has is worry. Nothing we say here can cure his worry. Only a thorough health check from a qualified doctor can help him stop worrying. I'm not brushing anything aside in any of his worries, here. I'm just saying clearly that worries like this need to be helped by a visit to a good doctor.



Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
Re: Is it possible?!  [message #67005 is a reply to message #67004] Sun, 16 September 2012 22:21 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Lachezar is currently offline  Lachezar   Macedonia

Getting started

Registered: September 2012
Messages: 3



That lack of energy dissapeared a long time ago as well as the itchy bumps. When they appeared for the first time, both of them, I told my parents about them. My father is a defectologist(i dont know if that is the right word in english) so he has that basic knowlegde about health and stuff. The lack of energy was(according to him) present because of the fact that I went sleeping very late like after 2 AM every night and woke up at 6 AM in the morning for school. i have been doing it for a pretty long time. I got the itchy bumps immediately after i got home from swimming in the lake. So my father said that it is some kind of allergy ( cause i have lots of them) or that i might be bitten by an insect. Now lets presume that i went to see a doctor. what should i say to him cause i have nothing at the moment and this happened a long time ago. at first i was really worrid but now my mind is at rest . dont know what else to say but thanks to all of you
Re: Is it possible?!  [message #67006 is a reply to message #67005] Sun, 16 September 2012 22:49 Go to previous messageGo to next message
timmy   United Kingdom

Has no life at all
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13515



I think in this I would trust your father Smile



Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
Re: Is it possible?!  [message #67009 is a reply to message #67006] Tue, 18 September 2012 06:43 Go to previous messageGo to next message
dgt224 is currently offline  dgt224   United States

Toe is in the water
Location: USA
Registered: May 2011
Messages: 81



I would go with Timmy on this one - your father sounds like he's got a pretty good handle on what was going on. Four hours of sleep a night is not enough for most people; unless you're one of the unusual folks who can get by on that much sleep, doing it for several days in a row can easily leave you feeling fatigued.

As for the itchy bumps after swimming, look up "swimmer's itch" on the web (or "cercarial dermatitis"), as it sounds a lot like what you described. Quick summary - you were likely invaded by parasites that can live in fresh water, burrow into your skin, and die there. They cause an intense, local allergic reaction, causing an itchy, bumpy, red rash where they penetrated the skin. The parasites are unable to live inside a human body, so unless the rash becomes infected by something else, it is annoying but harmless.

And I don't think "defectologist" is right, but I can't figure out what it should be. Any suggestions, anyone?
Re: Is it possible?!  [message #67010 is a reply to message #67009] Tue, 18 September 2012 06:58 Go to previous message
timmy   United Kingdom

Has no life at all
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13515



There's even a decent picture at Swimmer's_itch which may agree exactly with what you had. 

I can't work out 'defectologist' either! Sounds great, though!



Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
Previous Topic: I think we're in love!
Next Topic: Celebrate Bisexuality day
Goto Forum: