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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13752
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Let me illustrate.
"I'm just off to the club to play tennis". That means getting exilherated (sp?)with otherpeople, sometimes close physical proximity, and a naked experience with a shower, perhaps cubicled, perhaps communal, plus chnaging room cameraderie.
This is socially acceptable with other guys, other women, a mixture of the above, and is performed solo or in groups.
Touch another person in a non sporting manner and the whole world says "Sex!" and it thus has ot be regualted by taboos, ethics, laws, the lot.
What if sex were a pastime, a sport? Would that be so bad? [yes, STIs, HIV, I know all that. Don't go that route. Think outside the box when you reply]
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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I think it has to do with how society has become. Sex has become a taboo topic. Censorship, to protect citizens, and religion also plays a large part. Especially in places like the US where "freedom of religion" is important, religion in some cases forbid, or highly discourage sex before marriage, etc. Thus, this being taught to our children makes sex seem like it's bad, an evil. Also, the ever arising problems of abuse, rape, and other things cause people to worry that if they do ANYTHING inappropriate they will get sued. In a society that revolves around economics, we hear so many cases of people getting sued for "sexual or physical harrassment" for just a simple touch. There are cases where these harrassment are valid, and have merit. But even those that merely revolve around a touch of a shoulder that someone was uncomfortable can cause a disruption. (i don't have proof this happens, but you never know.) These simple touches force us to be cautious as to what we do. Can it be a hobby or a past time? maybe, but i doubt it as long as religion persists in the idea that sex before marriage is bad, and as long as greed exists where the legal system awards money for petty touches. I think also the movie plays a part where "romantic stories" are often, and that plays into mind. "it's worthless sex now, and I want something meaningful" or things like that. There are people who just search for sex sex sex, but we look down upon those people because we think they're using their bodies and also we think that sex is something that is to be done in the bedroom. That's how people have been raised, and how society has turned out to be. That's my opinion. I don't know whether it's correct, but that's what I can think of now. Great question though Timmy.
Al
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Timmy, I have been giving a lot of thought to your question... trying to think out of the box... asking the questions and thinking through the scenarios.
When I come to the end of my ability to think about the subject, I look into my heart and ask "Can I practice sex as a hobby or a simple pastime?" Now understand that my thinking is based on what I was brougt up thinking and believing having been raised in the Midwestern U.S... but I will tell you anyway for what it is worth.
I have a boyfriend I have been dating for a few months. We have had almost no sex until recently. We have talked about it at length, and have been very open about it. I was simply not comfortable having sex with him because in my heart of hearts I feel it is the ultimate I can give him, aside from continual and faithful friendship, companionship, and unconditional love. When we are able to look into each other's eyes, and know this is our utmost physical 'thing' for each other... knowing this is a culmination of everything in life that has led us to this point... and knowing we have this only for each other... makes this so awesome, extreme, personal, private, and celebratory.
To take that 'experience' and use that flippantly or loosely in my own personal life... well, I couldn't do that. It isn't in me as a person... the same as for me to have sex with a woman is just not in me. It is simply who I am not.
Now, I do not judge those that do have open sex and sexual relationships. That is not my place in life. I have only, however, tried to add to your 'questioning speculation' about this subject... and sorry if it is too long !!!!
BamBam
Celebrate your life... embrace your love... Become intimate with your place in forever !!!
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marc
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Needs to get a life! |
Registered: March 2003
Messages: 4729
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It is......
Try going to a bath house...
The game is still knocking balls around....
But the rules are a little different....
30 - Luv...... has a whole new meaning....
And your ball boys have an entirely different outlook.....
Life is great for me... Most of the time... But then I meet people online... Very few are real friends... Many say they are but know nothing of what it means... Some say they are, but are so shallow...
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If it's done in a casual manner, it demeans the act in my opinion. It's not something that's done just for fun IMO. Okay, some see it that way, but for me there pretty much has be one to also have the other. Well, okay, I *can* love without having sex, hehe, but the other way around is totally unsatisfactory for me.
-L
"But he that hath the steerage of my course,
direct my sail."
-William Shakespeare, Romeo and Juliet, Act One, Scene IV
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Zambezi
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Toe is in the water |
Location: Various (!)
Registered: January 2004
Messages: 40
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Er, Timmy, are you really sure you're talking about sex? Or are you talking about intimacy?
You see, go into any town centre pub in my home town - or, in all probability, yours too - on a Friday or Saturday night and it is just a pastime. You go in, look the right sort of person in the eye, buy them a drink, and that's it. And it doesn't matter if it's straight or gay sex you're after. It is nothing more than a pastime there, and for a huge chunk of men and women it is not just a sport, but a game as well.
But it's a very empty game, and there's never a winner.
Intimacy is the problem - whether the situation is overtly sexual or not. The truth is, society today sexualises intimacy automatically. And while most people crave both intimacy privately and sex publically they are all terrified of the combination of the two because in most minds it defines commitments they can't make or "gayness" they can't tolerate. Sex without intimacy is nineteen to the dozen and falls within the experience of many, so it's not scary or the start of a commitment. Most people have never experienced intimacy without sex, and cannot conceive of the former without the latter. In our emotionally stunted world, that is scary.
If at first you don't succeed, then skydiving isn't for you.
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13752
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I truly am thinking about sex, not intimacy. A game of tennis (my metaphor) is not intimate. It can create intimacy between opponents or doubles partners, but it is not, of itself, an intimate game.
But I am thinking past Marc's bath-house and Zambezi's pub. I am thinking of planned encounters not entirely unlike booking a tennis court, but not (usually) played out in public.
I am truly thinking of it as an "acceptable hobby" or a "pleasant sport", not behind closed doors, nor in a meat market, but as something that people accept they will do together, and their regular "emotional partners" accept as normal and healthy.
I mean a "non clandestine" event with no negative connotations.
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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Hmmm Sex could be a pastime. I mean I understand all about that sports stuff.... Truthfully though I have ducked 3 months of gym classes now and to me that whol locker room comraderie is painful for much the same reason sex isnt a pasttime of mine. No matter which one you do there are far to many people underdressed for my tastes. I think that people get all upity about sexbecuase it involves part of you going into another part of someone (normally.) With sporta itsjust like casual touching. But then why isn't casual sex good. Hmmm I'll ponder this further I think....
love
andy
Why are you wearing that stupid man suit?
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There are cultures in which sex is recreational in the way you describe it, Timmy. It's thus considered fun and beneficial like tennis, but unremarkable otherwise.
It's an attitude that has much to recommend it, as long as the paramaters mentioned so far are part of the picture...that it doesn't impact negatively on significant others, that there's no cooercion involved, that sort of thing.
Sure! Why not?
"Always forgive your enemies...nothing annoys them quite so much." Oscar Wilde
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We each apply personal acceptable limits as to what sex can be for ourselves. And if we are really good at it, we don't apply that same standard to everyone else. So if our personal limits don't exclude sex as a recreational activity ..... the why the heck not.
After all, our limits are our own.
Respect others right to set their own limits and try not to judge them to harshly if they are different from our own.
I am sure some people already feel like that.
Just my opinion,
Kevin
"Be excellent to each other, and, party on dudes"!
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If I, as a person who do not view sex as a pastime, were to get together with a person who does have those views, my counterpart would have to accept limiting their sexual recreational activities to only take place with me. ;-D
Hugs & take care Kevin! 
-L
"But he that hath the steerage of my course,
direct my sail."
-William Shakespeare, Romeo and Juliet, Act One, Scene IV
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Those are your personal limits, mine too by the way. But that does not make the other person wrong, just not for you.
Kevin
"Be excellent to each other, and, party on dudes"!
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13752
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I can't reconcile this with gym saunas and an asian guy, Lenny.
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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And men from all over the world and every country participate. I'm not saying all men, just that men from everywhere do it. If they don't then why can you find a "House of Ill Repute" in every country of the world? And what is a visit with a prostitute if not pure recreational sex with no strings (other than the fee) attached.
Just my opinion.
Hugs, Charlie
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Why can't sex be a hobby, or a pastime 
To me, sex is a physical expression of feelings, of love... 
Re: Why can't sex be a hobby, or a pastime 
