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Hey cossie
I just re-read what I had written in that post and I inadvertantly said irregular noun and I was intending to say verb.
Sometimes it just doesnt pay to get up in the morning at all!!
God knows I am not an expert in this and barely got it right 43 years ago, so I concede to your knowledge here. All I know is that it helped me immensly in learning German and in turn, learning my English more. I saw the patterns were there and especially if you looked into the old familiar form of English which was used in the King James Bible.
I sometimes still get confused with certain spellings like words which have double l's in them. It is sometimes written with one and sometimes with two depending on British or American English being used. I read books where the writer is English and then get my American spelling wrong next time I write something.
I find it extrememly amusing sometimes to hear the words used by British people for parts of a car for instance and it means entirely something different here in USA. So what? It is just useage and nothing more, sort of like slang terms used by teens in this country which make me look like I am a dummy for not knowing what they mean.
I know that sometimes it can change the meaning of a story if you are not aware of some of these things. I had no idea what the hell "trainers" were when used in some of the Nifty stories. Took me a couple of years to figure it out for sure............tennis shoes here! At first I thought they were some kind of special stockings or something! I know there are a lot of other words like that, but I just would like to understand better what I am reading, so maybe someone will make a list.
Ken
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cossie
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On fire! |
Location: Exiled in North East Engl...
Registered: July 2003
Messages: 1699
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What happened in the conversion period was that nouns other that those reflecting sexual distinctions were, in effect, neutered. It's as if German converted every masculine (Der) or feminine (Die) noun to a neuter (Das) noun, except for nouns indicating sex. So, theoretically, I suppose one could say that all non-sexual English nouns are neuter, but that's surely a rather trite distinction?
As regards ships, the practice of treating them as feminine is pretty ancient, but (whilst steadfastly avoiding the use of a word like 'anthropomorphism'!) Deeej is right in suggesting that it's a matter of custom rather than a true assignment of gender. I'm not entirely certain what he means by it applying only to a single ship, because English doesn't normally distinguish gender (or sex) in the plural, but the custom of allocating feminine gender has spread to steam locomotives and indeed to any substantial piece of machinery. This can have surprising consequences; if one quotes 'I rode the Duke of Gloucester and she behaved impeccably' out of context, it sets the imagination on fire! (The Duke of Gloucester was the most powerful passenger locomotive built by Britain's railways while in state ownership!).
For a' that an' a' that,
It's comin' yet for a' that,
That man tae man, the worrld o'er
Shall brithers be, for a' that.
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cossie
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On fire! |
Location: Exiled in North East Engl...
Registered: July 2003
Messages: 1699
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... provoked no response simply because we were stunned by your brilliance and perception!
This time, I feel that a little clarification is in order. First of all, the Anglian and Saxon languages were related, but not identical - so speech in Wessex (Saxon) was significantly different from speech in Northumbria (Anglian). With reinforcement from Norse and Danish sources, it's certainly true that the 'Danelaw' used a declension-based language, whilst the 'English' of Wessex was position-based. This is the change which was achieved in the Anglo-Saxon period (which modern scholars call 'Old English') However, gender distinction survived into the triumphant 'position based' usage - the two concepts are linked, but not inter-dependent. It was the 300-year 'suppression' of English which finally saw off gender distinctions.
You are of course right about the vowel-shift - though I can't get the URL to work for me - but it was only one of many changes (admittedly more often consonantal) in the development of our language. Radio and Television have suppressed many of our English dialects, but the 'Geordie' accent of the area around the River Tyne is more resilient than most. It has its very own vowel shift - any vowel other than 'a', when followed by 'r', is pronounced as a short 'o'. So 'permanent' is pronounced as 'pormanent', 'sir' becomes 'sor', and 'burn' becomes 'born'. This isn'y the only vowel shift! I married into a 'Geordie' family, and one of my wife's uncles once explained to me his experiences working as a groom in the 1930s in 'Korkley Haal'. I got a round of applause when I correctly translated the location as 'Kirkley Hall'!
For a' that an' a' that,
It's comin' yet for a' that,
That man tae man, the worrld o'er
Shall brithers be, for a' that.
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cossie wrote:
What happened in the conversion period was that nouns other that those reflecting sexual distinctions were, in effect, neutered. It's as if German converted every masculine (Der) or feminine (Die) noun to a neuter (Das) noun, except for nouns indicating sex.
No sex, please - we're English! 
The paradox has often been noted that the United States, founded in secularism, is now the most religiose country in Christendom, while England, with an established church headed by its constitutional monarch, is among the least. (Richard Dawkins, 2006)
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cossie wrote:
Your previous contributions to the discussion provoked no response simply because we were stunned by your brilliance and perception!
Cossie, your fee would be in the post if I could afford it. 
The paradox has often been noted that the United States, founded in secularism, is now the most religiose country in Christendom, while England, with an established church headed by its constitutional monarch, is among the least. (Richard Dawkins, 2006)
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Re Cossie:
…much as happens near where I live. If you cross the river e becomes a. It's where the farmaers wear smally wallies. Similar, but I think this is coincidence, where e becomes a in Swiss German, an example of Rückumlaut there.
Hugs
N
I dream of boys with big bulges in their trousers,
Never of girls with big bulges in their blouses.
…and look forward to meeting you in Cóito.
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"HISTORICAL FOOTNOTE: Aluminum was originally named "alumium" by Sir Humphry Davy, who later changed it to "aluminum" (perhaps in an attempt to make it more Latinized since alumen is Latin for alum, the aluminum compound that the name is derived from). The British (and allied English speakers) shortly thereafter changed the name once more, this time to "aluminium" so that it would again match the pattern of most other elements (helium, sodium, etc.), while the North Americans eventually decided to keep the second, slightly more traditional name. I predict that North Americans will adopt the more regular "-ium" spelling by the year 2050, prompting the British to start calling it "alumininium". At that point debate can begin on changing "platinum" to "platinium""
From my "favorite" web site:
http://zapatopi.net/afdb//
(\\__/) And if you don't believe The sun will rise
(='.'=) Stand alone and greet The coming night
(")_(") In the last remaining light. (C. Cornell)
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cossie
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On fire! |
Location: Exiled in North East Engl...
Registered: July 2003
Messages: 1699
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... this point has already been covered (see my post of April 21, 01.49). I demand satisfaction! It's either pistols at dawn, or you'll be hearing from my lawyers!
For a' that an' a' that,
It's comin' yet for a' that,
That man tae man, the worrld o'er
Shall brithers be, for a' that.
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Ill be the referee
I believe in Karma....what you give is what you get returned........
Affirmation........Savage Garden
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