|
|
|
|
Ok had some test ran on me this morning, MRI, CAT scan, MRI with contrast, and CAT scan with contrast. For two reasons one yearly scan, and second is that lately I have been losing track of time, which is a sign that I am having seizure. Which my last one was little under a year ago. And have not taken any meds in like 6 months. But all my scans came back Okay. So that a load off my chest. And that’s why I have been down the past couple of days.
Jay
So say what you want
(You know I'm wasting all my time)
You've gotta mean it when you say what you want
(You're only safe when you're alone)
And everybody's on your mind
Saying anything to get you by
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I'm glad that everything seems okay.
Do you know if you'll be able to get an FAA Class 1 medical on that basis?
David
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
marc
|
 |
Needs to get a life! |
Registered: March 2003
Messages: 4729
|
|
|
It will not be possible to get a pilots license if you have debilitating seizures.
Life is great for me... Most of the time... But then I meet people online... Very few are real friends... Many say they are but know nothing of what it means... Some say they are, but are so shallow...
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Jay,
It very much depends on how problematic your medical problems are. For private pilots, you can get a waiver on most things. In my case, I'm fairly sure that I could quite easily get a waiver under the FAA's system despite my poor eyesight in my left eye, because I looked into the subject a couple of years ago.
Commercial medicals are very difficult to get if you have had any sort of medical condition in the past, even if they are totally clear now. I doubt I would be able to get one, even if I didn't have the problem with my eye (which certainly prevents it). I think the same holds for a lot of people who might otherwise have liked to become professional pilots. So, obviously, before committing any money, that's the first thing to find out about. Good luck!
David
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
There should be no problem. Most cases when they stop they stop for good. (So I am told)
Oh I had Absences seizure, here’s some info for you all.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Absence_seizure
http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/petit-mal-seizure/DS00216
Sorry I did not post back sooner. It is funny that after every test with contrast I always feel real sick a couple of hours later
Jay
So say what you want
(You know I'm wasting all my time)
You've gotta mean it when you say what you want
(You're only safe when you're alone)
And everybody's on your mind
Saying anything to get you by
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I'd recommend you find out for sure anyway. I would hate for your hopes to be dashed at the very last moment. My eyesight problems are minor and completely unnoticeable to me most of the time, and yet they prevent me from getting a normal, run-of-the-mill European (JAA) private pilot's licence. Sometimes these things are more significant than you expect.
David
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I know that why I going to set up to get a clean bill of health before I start class.
So say what you want
(You know I'm wasting all my time)
You've gotta mean it when you say what you want
(You're only safe when you're alone)
And everybody's on your mind
Saying anything to get you by
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
marc
|
|
Needs to get a life! |
Registered: March 2003
Messages: 4729
|
|
|
Well, if thats the case then I will have to make a point of asking if the pilots of planes I fly on have a history of seizures.....
If so........
I'll take the bus.......
Life is great for me... Most of the time... But then I meet people online... Very few are real friends... Many say they are but know nothing of what it means... Some say they are, but are so shallow...
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
hey just keep in mind that in a planes there are two pilots. and on a bus there is only on driver.
So say what you want
(You know I'm wasting all my time)
You've gotta mean it when you say what you want
(You're only safe when you're alone)
And everybody's on your mind
Saying anything to get you by
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
>just keep in mind that in a planes there are two pilots. and on a bus there is only on driver
Jay,
Thank-you so much for that chilling bit of news. Really made my day! lol
Teddy
“There's no grays, only white that's got grubby. I'm surprised you don't know that. And sin, young man, is when you treat people as things. Including yourself. That's what sin is.” - Terry Pratchett
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
marc
|
|
Needs to get a life! |
Registered: March 2003
Messages: 4729
|
|
|
Hey keep in mind that the bus is on the ground....
A plane is mostly not when it is going somewhere....
Nevertheless.... With the knowledge that you were, are, and with the possibility of having a seizure no person should get on a plane with you in control.
Actually....... If you were the bus driver I would opt to drive myself.....
[Updated on: Thu, 09 November 2006 10:01]
Life is great for me... Most of the time... But then I meet people online... Very few are real friends... Many say they are but know nothing of what it means... Some say they are, but are so shallow...
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
even if i had one the odds of any one noting that i had is very low. see how they only last a few sec's and it look like i am out of it. but thanks marc I let you know what flight i fly, or maybe i wont.
So say what you want
(You know I'm wasting all my time)
You've gotta mean it when you say what you want
(You're only safe when you're alone)
And everybody's on your mind
Saying anything to get you by
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
marc
|
|
Needs to get a life! |
Registered: March 2003
Messages: 4729
|
|
|
But you see that is the thing...
Knowing this, how can I possibly not report it to the FAA?
Life is great for me... Most of the time... But then I meet people online... Very few are real friends... Many say they are but know nothing of what it means... Some say they are, but are so shallow...
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
It's not your problem, Marc. It's Jay's. I have no doubt that he will tell the doctor at his medical; it is then up to the doctor and the FAA to make a decision based on his medical history. If they say it's okay, then we have to trust them. Aviation medicine is a well-established and well-respected field. It's not in the FAA's interests to pass anyone whose health could pose a risk either to himself or anyone else.
David
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Hey I am having fun with marc. he dose not need to stop. But I did talk to my doc and she says that if my next scan is good which is in a year That the chances of me haveing a seizure go down to like 0%. the type I had rarly last in to atuld hood.
"Many children with petit mal seizures outgrow their seizure disorder. By late adolescence..."
"People with absence epilepsy have repeated absence seizures that cause momentary lapses of consciousness. These seizures almost always begin in childhood or adolescence, and they tend to run in families, suggesting that they may be genetic. Some people with absence seizures have purposeless movements during their seizures, such as a jerking arm or rapidly blinking eyes. Others have no noticeable symptoms except for brief times when they are "out of it." Immediately after a seizure, the person can resume whatever he or she was doing. These seizures can happen a few times a day or in some cases hundreds of times a day to the point that the person cannot concentrate in school or other situations. Childhood absence epilepsy usually stops when the child reaches puberty. Absence seizures usually have no lasting effect on intelligence or other brain functions"
So say what you want
(You know I'm wasting all my time)
You've gotta mean it when you say what you want
(You're only safe when you're alone)
And everybody's on your mind
Saying anything to get you by
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
http://www.faa.gov/about/office_org/headquarters_offices/avs/offices/aam/ame/guide/app_process/exam_tech/item46/amd/nc/
At the very least you will need to get an official decision from the FAA.
"21 Infrequently, the FAA has granted an Authorization under the special issuance section of part 67 14 CFR 67.401 when a seizure disorder was present in childhood but the individual has been seizure-free for a number of years. Factors that would be considered in determining eligibility in such cases would be age at onset, nature and frequency of seizures, precipitating causes, and duration of stability without medication. Followup evaluations are usually necessary to confirm continued stability of an individual's condition if an Authorization is granted under the special issuance section of part 67 14 CFR 67.401."
The problems as I foresee them are:
i. they say "infrequently", so a positive decision is by no means guaranteed
ii. you have not been seizure free for a number of years (less than one, you say) -- in other words, you may need to wait several years before being able to get a medical.
iii. even assuming a positive decision, any problems of that type in the past greatly lower the probability that you will be able to get a full class 1 medical, rather than a class 2 or 3. A class 1 is essential if you want to make a career out of flying.
Flying is much more dangerous than driving, for there is no way to stop if there's a problem. If you're on your own and the seizure lasts more than a few seconds, there's a very high probability that it will send you out of control. If at a critical stage of the flight, a seizure of 1 second could probably kill you. That you have a co-pilot will not convince the FAA -- if you have one (which you don't always), he is there to provide insurance against anything unanticipated happening to you, not something that can be anticipated. He may not be able to take over in time, anyway.
David
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
it will be a year the first of the year. but it is un know the day that they stoped for sure it will be one year from the first clean scan.
So say what you want
(You know I'm wasting all my time)
You've gotta mean it when you say what you want
(You're only safe when you're alone)
And everybody's on your mind
Saying anything to get you by
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
second you start out as the co-pilot. and you several years before getting the the left seat
So say what you want
(You know I'm wasting all my time)
You've gotta mean it when you say what you want
(You're only safe when you're alone)
And everybody's on your mind
Saying anything to get you by
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
In an airline context, yes. But that's irrelevant. The first officer also flies the plane when the captain is busy doing something else (maybe not even on the flight deck). He has to be just as healthy, and therefore the health regulations for him are just the same as for the captain.
Anyway, during training you will certainly be in control of aircraft, and not always with an instructor or captain there to take over in an emergency.
I don't think there's much else I can say. You don't need to convince me, only a medical examiner. If you detect a dubious tone, it's because until a couple of years ago I was pretty sure that I would have no problems passing all standards of medical. Then I read the regulations, and discovered that, as the rules stood at the time, it would be virtually impossible to get a European (JAA) medical. Even in the FAA, it would still be complicated, purely on the basis of my eyesight. My right eye is perfect with correction, and okay without glasses; my left eye is lazy. This had never presented any problems for me when either driving or flying, so until then I had been inclined to discount it entirely.
David
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Oh, don't get me wrong I agree with you whole hearted, about that. I will not give up on it until I am told that I can't get one. but if I would have agree with you and marc from the start we would have not had this chat.
So say what you want
(You know I'm wasting all my time)
You've gotta mean it when you say what you want
(You're only safe when you're alone)
And everybody's on your mind
Saying anything to get you by
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Good luck, then. I hope as much as anyone that you will pass the medical.
When do you think you'll be able to take one? On the whole, it's probably best to do it sooner rather than later because there's a lot of paperwork and you will need the FAA to give you some sort of waiver.
David
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
marc
|
|
Needs to get a life! |
Registered: March 2003
Messages: 4729
|
|
|
David,
Yes, it is my problem. The restrictions for an avaiation carreer are many and aviation medicine is well....... medicine.... I think you well know my opinion of that breed.....
Nevertheless.... I can not think of a single person who would choose a pilot that has a history of seizure.
Actually, I don't think they are allowed drivers licenses as well....
I shall look into that presently.... then get back to you....
Life is great for me... Most of the time... But then I meet people online... Very few are real friends... Many say they are but know nothing of what it means... Some say they are, but are so shallow...
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Marc said,
>I can not think of a single person who would choose a pilot that has a history of seizure.
Well, there's the link to the FAA's web site that I gave to Jason that says,
"Infrequently, the FAA has granted an Authorization under the special issuance section of part 67 14 CFR 67.401 when a seizure disorder was present in childhood but the individual has been seizure-free for a number of years."
I don't know what type of medical this is for -- I'd be very surprised if it were for a full, Class 1 medical -- but it does seem to indicate that a history of seizure is not an open-and-shut case.
I know you don't like doctors, but I assure you that the sole purpose of an aviation medical is to ensure that you are safe to fly a plane. Medical examiners are not interested in any medical details that are not relevant -- they are a matter for the pilot and his GP only (or no-one, if he does not wish to see a GP).
I look forward to hearing what you conclude.
David
[Updated on: Thu, 09 November 2006 17:56] |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
marc
|
|
Needs to get a life! |
Registered: March 2003
Messages: 4729
|
|
|
Well I read the same report on seizures and the obtaining of a "special dispensation" toward the issuance of a pilots license.
I like doctors just fine.... It is the practitioners of medicine I despise.
As far as doctor-patient privilege..... once the conversation crossed the threshold of a public communication it is within the public domain and as such no longer a private issue.
I was also wondering.... Is dyslexia (sp) per se a hinderance to a pilots license? One would expect a pilot to see dial settings correctly when operating an aircraft.
[Updated on: Thu, 09 November 2006 18:10]
Life is great for me... Most of the time... But then I meet people online... Very few are real friends... Many say they are but know nothing of what it means... Some say they are, but are so shallow...
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
timmy
|
 |
Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13751
|
|
|
OK, that sounds really ominous and threatening. Seriously threatening. I am more upset than you could possibly imagine.
I read into it that anything that is posted here that you disagree with and that is reportable to an authority you will report.
I am going only on the words you have written. But they mean I feel that any trust here has been broken. I may as well close this place down.
Trust me, I am really upset to see this. To me this means you have single handedly ruined everything I have been working for. No-one can now trust you. Previously anyhting here simply risked the reaction of an unknown audience. Now you have said you will report this to the FAA.
You have said repeatedly that the name is misleading. Now you have taken it upon yourself to make it so. Congratulations.
I had never expected to be let down in this way by you. never.
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
marc
|
|
Needs to get a life! |
Registered: March 2003
Messages: 4729
|
|
|
Fact.....
Pilots having seizures crash their aircraft.....
Fact.....
I have the right to not have a pilot that is not prone to seizures.....
If my right to a safe flight upsets you..... then be upset.....
If my right to complain about something I see as untoward upsets you..... then be upset.......
Another fact...... When I see something untoward I do what is right.... Not what is popular..... right........
Life is great for me... Most of the time... But then I meet people online... Very few are real friends... Many say they are but know nothing of what it means... Some say they are, but are so shallow...
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Marc said,
>I like doctors just fine.... It is the practitioners of medicine I despise.
When I say "doctor" I mean practising medical doctor. I assume, in this context, you are aware of what I mean. Therefore that's a somewhat useless contradiction in terms.
>As far as doctor-patient privilege..... once the conversation crossed the threshold of a public communication it is within the public domain and as such no longer a private issue.
You mean if Jay discusses it here? Don't be ridiculous. Jason is for all intents and purposes anonymous except to those people he has chosen to reveal his identity to. Therefore there is no reason -- and hopefully no way -- to take it any further than confidential chat, on his own terms.
I have seen nothing to make me suspect that he is planning anything unethical. I can trust him to discuss the manner in a mature manner with the relevant medical examiner. The law requires that he report anything important, anyway. You are in no position of authority either over him, nor do you have any recognised professional status in the aviation or medical industries. It's not your responsibility to get involved -- indeed, you'd be breaching this forum's rules as a "place of safety" if you did.
>I was also wondering.... Is dyslexia (sp) per se a hinderance to a pilots license? One would expect a pilot to see dial settings correctly when operating an aircraft.
A diagnosis of dyslexia is irrelevant. In practical tests it is up to the pilot to demonstrate that he can read the dials and documentation properly. There is no way to get to professional level without taking dozens of those exams. Any difficulties would be caught, and if possible, remedied, well before certification.
David
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
timmy
|
|
Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13751
|
|
|
What you have just done is indefensible. Your reply is indefensible. Your threats are indefensible. Consider your actions most carefully, and consider your words more carefully. You are single handedly wrecking this forum and its objectives.
You are plain wrong in threatening another member here. I cannto believe your actions or lack of regard for anyone else here. You say you need this forum. You act like you wish it to be closed.
Your behaviour in this is intolerable. This is now a choice you have to make. You will retract this, all of it, or you will leave.
Even then I still may have to close it down because you have single handedly wrecked it. No-one can now trust you. No-one.
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Jedediah
|
 |
Likes it here |
Location: Made in NZ
Registered: March 2006
Messages: 170
|
|
|
Marc, you've excelled yourself this time. Noone disagrees that pilots being prone to seizures would be worrying, but, as has been posted, this may not be a problem. Presumably people certifying pilots know what they're doing - it is a highly safety-conscious industry.
Timmy is absolutely right - you are threatening the confidence of anyone who posts here. Don't you want it to be "a place of safety"?
cheers
E Te Atua tukuna mai ki au te Mauri tauki te tango i nga mea
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
marc
|
|
Needs to get a life! |
Registered: March 2003
Messages: 4729
|
|
|
Do you in your wildest imagination think I ever had any expectation that people here trust me?
Not in a nanosecond....
Do you think that the title of this forum is in any way immune to law? How can you expect something said here not be reported to the proper authorities when warranted? How can you imagine that this site is not monitored on a moment to moment basis?
Life is great for me... Most of the time... But then I meet people online... Very few are real friends... Many say they are but know nothing of what it means... Some say they are, but are so shallow...
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
timmy
|
|
Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13751
|
|
|
I have told you that you have a simple choice. Retract all or leave.
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Marc said,
>Fact..... Pilots having seizures crash their aircraft.....
This is a matter for the FAA and other aviation authorities, not you. If you fly in an aircraft, you have to trust them. If you don't trust them on medical grounds, then you should not be able to trust them on the integrity of the aircraft or the competence of the pilots either. If you don't fly, then your own opinion is irrelevant to everyone who does.
More to the point than your "fact" (do you have a citation?) is the question: how often do pilots, after acknowledgement and approval by the FAA of their previous susceptibility to seizure go on to have a seizure in flight and crash the aircraft? I would suspect not very many.
>Fact..... I have the right to not have a pilot that is not prone to seizures.....
Assuming that you actually meant "I have the right to have a pilot that is not prone to seizures", then of course you do. All you have to do is not fly.
>If my right to a safe flight upsets you..... then be upset.....
Who are you talking to? Jason? Timmy? The FAA? For it is the FAA's business, and if you feel strongly about it, take it up with them. Jason is bound to their rules. It's not as if he is planning to break them.
>If my right to complain about something I see as untoward upsets you..... then be upset.......
What a horrible thing to say.
>Another fact...... When I see something untoward I do what is right.... Not what is popular..... right........
Right would be to contact the FAA and ask them for clarification. Not to come here and take it out on all of us.
David
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
marc
|
|
Needs to get a life! |
Registered: March 2003
Messages: 4729
|
|
|
ok i retract all.....
Life is great for me... Most of the time... But then I meet people online... Very few are real friends... Many say they are but know nothing of what it means... Some say they are, but are so shallow...
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
timmy
|
|
Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13751
|
|
|
Thank you. I accept your choice. You remain welcome.
I would like to understand how we can now feel OK about this, but I think we should wait a short time before this topic is raised. A time for healing is required.
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Just thought I ought to clarify when I say, "Right would be to contact the FAA and ask them for clarification" I do NOT mean reporting a person to them as being in some way "dangerous". I mean finding out about their regulations and credentials to set your mind at rest that they do in fact know what they are talking about.
David
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Jedediah
|
|
Likes it here |
Location: Made in NZ
Registered: March 2006
Messages: 170
|
|
|
Amen. And thanks.
Jay, you follow your dreams.
cheers
E Te Atua tukuna mai ki au te Mauri tauki te tango i nga mea
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
marc
|
|
Needs to get a life! |
Registered: March 2003
Messages: 4729
|
|
|
I prefer it to be fresh in my mind....
I see aviation as a matter of trust..... One who flies must trust the flyer.
I do not see a medical impediment that disrupts cognitive function as a trustworthy trait.
.......even if i had one the odds of any one noting that i had is very low....
This above comment by Jay indicates to me that a degree of planned omission is apparent as to the question of seizures..... This rings strong to me and it should to anyone else with any sense.
Why I find myself having to explain myself is to me a violation of trust as well....
Life is great for me... Most of the time... But then I meet people online... Very few are real friends... Many say they are but know nothing of what it means... Some say they are, but are so shallow...
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Marc said,
>I do not see a medical impediment that disrupts cognitive function as a trustworthy trait.
It's all a question of probability. If someone previously had a condition, but it went away, and can be demonstrated now to be for all intents and purposes irrelevant then I have no problem trusting and authority that okays it.
It is also possible that someone with no history at all -- who has passed the medical -- will develop a similar symptom in mid-air.
It is also possible that an otherwise perfectly healthy person will have a slight heart murmur. It might mean that there is a greater probability of a heart attack, or it might, for all intents and purposes, mean nothing. If a cardiologist says it is safe, then he is staking his professional reputation on it. He knows a lot more about it than you or I do.
Of course, some people with no prior symptoms whatsoever may also have a sudden heart attack.
If every tiny probability is treated as a major problem, then no-one at all would ever be able to qualify as a pilot. The industry could not exist. That is why there are two pilots on every commercial passenger flight, and numerous backup systems.
David
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
marc
|
|
Needs to get a life! |
Registered: March 2003
Messages: 4729
|
|
|
And I agree totally.....
But ! ! ! ! !
Jay made a comment stating he intentionally intended to evade the question........
This inflates a small issue to a huge one.......
See it all boils down to integrity..... If someone misleads a small detail then they have the impetus to evade a large one.....
Life is great for me... Most of the time... But then I meet people online... Very few are real friends... Many say they are but know nothing of what it means... Some say they are, but are so shallow...
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
] 
A Place of Safety
Search
Help
Register
Login
Home
I am very seriously upset by this. 
