|
|
|
|
Not being religious but rather spiritual I too get into this season, as others have said it’s also my favorite time of year. At least if at no other time of the year, most do try to express good will and peace to others.
In acknowledgment to the origins of this celebration and LOL my ancestry, yes folk I admit it I have not only British but Scots and Irish ancestry, plus about an eighth American Indian, Ummm and well, French also hehehe What a mess huh, well, at lest I must say it was the Frenchman that brought the Indian into the mix. : )
Anyway this vid is in honor of the winter solstice. Please check it out, if you do, take note of the guy sitting in a chair wearing a stylish stag horn hat. That’s me LOL.
Actually I’m going to put two up. I know most of us probably ignore these. But hey, worth a try.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6qcPS-J0HTg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W6wLooceRYI
People will tell you where they've gone
They'll tell you where to go
But till you get there yourself you never really know
Where some have found their paradise
Other's just come to harm
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
marc
|
 |
Needs to get a life! |
Registered: March 2003
Messages: 4729
|
|
|
Solstice Bells is one of my all time favorite pieces of music.
It really brought back a ton of good memories listening to it.
Thanks Rich....
huge huggs.... Have a good holiday season....
Life is great for me... Most of the time... But then I meet people online... Very few are real friends... Many say they are but know nothing of what it means... Some say they are, but are so shallow...
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Thanks for posting those links - brought back all kinds of memories for me! "Life's a long song" was one of the few 45's (ie vinyl singles) that I bought: I still have it in a box in a cupboard somewhere.
NW
"The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral, begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy. ... Returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night devoid of stars." Martin Luther King
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Whitop
|
 |
Toe is in the water |
Location: USA
Registered: June 2005
Messages: 73
|
|
|
My favorite day of the year. Because tomorrow the days start getting longer!
It's the first day of Winter and the cherry trees were blooming yesterday in Brooklyn. Somethings wrong! At least the solstice doesn't change. ---- yet.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
the solstice this year is on the 22nd, not the 21st... it varies every-so-often...
which is good for me, the solstice on my birthday makes it a VERY special celebration, from a druidists point of view.
Odi et amo: quare id faciam, fortasse requiris.
Nescio, set fieri sentio et excrucior
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I should have been clearer I guess but yeah 22 min. after midnight the morning of the 22nd. Thank you good Prince.
And though it may be early, Happy Birthday : )
Most people I know that have their B day this close to Christmas are kinda bummed by the fact, cool to see you’re not.
Peace
I’ll be at work as the solstice rolls in, hopefully it’ll be an easy night : P
People will tell you where they've gone
They'll tell you where to go
But till you get there yourself you never really know
Where some have found their paradise
Other's just come to harm
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
But which time zone? Or is it UTC/GMT?
Hugs
N
I dream of boys with big bulges in their trousers,
Never of girls with big bulges in their blouses.
…and look forward to meeting you in Cóito.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
UTC
22 past 12 on the 22 of the 12
cheers, Arich
there have been times when having a birthday this close to christmas is good. it has meant in the past that i get a combined present worth far more than anything i'd have gotten for an individual event.
though i think the sword i was hinting for hasn't put in an appearence... oh well...
Odi et amo: quare id faciam, fortasse requiris.
Nescio, set fieri sentio et excrucior
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Whitop
|
|
Toe is in the water |
Location: USA
Registered: June 2005
Messages: 73
|
|
|
It happened when it happened. And when it happened, it was 7:22PM, still on the 21st here. -Mac
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Hi Rich,
Thanks for posting those links. I enjoyed listening to them, though I wasn't familiar with the songs.
I hope that you and everyone else here have an enjoyable and fulfilling Christmas.
>I admit it I have not only British but Scots and Irish ancestry
Excuse my pedantry, but I'm just wondering what this means. Scotland is part of Britain, along with England and Wales. Do you mean you have Scottish and Irish ancestry (Irish sometimes loosely if slightly inaccurately counting as British when all of Ireland was part of the UK) but no English or Welsh? Or do you mean you have not only English but Scots and Irish ancestry? Sorry -- I have a sort of bee in my bonnet about this, as no-one from outside the UK ever seems to get it right... 
David
[Updated on: Fri, 22 December 2006 17:04] |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
marc
|
|
Needs to get a life! |
Registered: March 2003
Messages: 4729
|
|
|
My friend Annie.... A nice artist lady of about 95 years young we know from our place of business was born in Scotland....
According to her.... and she makes the point with some authority....
England was graciously, albeit begrudgingly, allowed to associate itself with Scotland with all the flourish and ceremony a Scotsman could possibly muster at the time.
According to her, the country as the world knows it, should rightly be renamed to "Great Scotland".
If you try and argue the finer points of historical relavance with her you risk life and limb.... and her bony old knuckles really really can pinch hard....
Life is great for me... Most of the time... But then I meet people online... Very few are real friends... Many say they are but know nothing of what it means... Some say they are, but are so shallow...
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
The only question I would have for her is: assuming that she doesn't live in Scotland, why doesn't she?
It always amuses me how it is those people who do not live in a country (and in many cases who have never lived in it) who are they ones who most vociferously hype their credentials as ambassadors for it. In my opinion, the most convincing Scottish nationalists are the ones who have lived in Scotland all their lives. (If Annie does in fact live in Scotland, and comes to visit you from afar, then I take it all back.)
I appreciate that her words were probably a joke, but I'm lost by the logic of "Great Scotland". Great Britain is not so named because of any supposed "greatness" of England or any of its constituent countries, but simply:
i. that the island happens to be called Britain (as it was named by the Romans, long before Scotland existed as a united nation), and
ii. that it happens to be the larger of two areas of approximately that name (the other being Brittany in France). Hence "Great Britain".
Incidentally, though I was born and bred in England, my mother is Irish. I have family in both Scotland and Ireland and I would never think of belittling anyone from any of the UK's constituent countries on the basis of their nationality (not even the Welsh!). I tend to think of myself as British (or "from the UK") rather than "English", which I view as a slightly provincial term (though I may be slightly unusual among English people for holding this view).
David
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
LOL Yup Yup that is indeed what I meant. Though I must admit, I am still having a hard time wrapping my head around the distinction, but I think I understand. English, Scots and Welsh being culturally distinct yet part of the British Islands, and this is the source of my confusion I suppose. Ireland is only kind of British?
I find this very interesting, though I know this has been discussed before but could you clarify just a bit more. I do get the British part that was a total misnomer. Thanks David.
People will tell you where they've gone
They'll tell you where to go
But till you get there yourself you never really know
Where some have found their paradise
Other's just come to harm
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Disregard my last post; this post has done the job already. Thanks
Rich
People will tell you where they've gone
They'll tell you where to go
But till you get there yourself you never really know
Where some have found their paradise
Other's just come to harm
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
"British" most commonly means "from the island of Britain". The island of Britain is made up of England, Scotland and Wales. Thus a person from any of those three is both English/Scottish/Welsh and British.
The island of Ireland is part of the British Isles but not part of mainland Britain. Thus an Irish person is not normally considered British.
The confusion comes in when you appreciate that, though Northern Ireland is not part of Britain, the inhabitants sometimes like to call themselves British because Northern Ireland is part of the same country as England, Scotland and Wales (together they all make up the United Kingdom), and there is no adjective that means simply "from the UK".
Thus you can sometimes get away with calling Northern Irish people British (but only if they are staunch unionists; if they were nationalists they'd probably beat you up, because they'd rather be considered "Irish") but never people from the Republic of Ireland (because Eire is an entirely different country from the UK and has been since 1922).
On the whole -- and especially if you're not sure -- it's best to stick to "British" for people from the island of Britain, and "Irish" for both Northern and Southern Irish. It's safest.
David
[Updated on: Sat, 23 December 2006 01:48] |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
LOL you have to understand, we here in the US have a hard time with these kinds of things. I mean I would venture to guess that the majority of Americans don’t even realize that Puerto Rico is a common wealth of the US, as are several other states. They pay taxes, vote and have representation in the government. We are getting better of late; I’ve heard we are starting to excel in our understanding of geo politics and geography. Hopefully less self centered, for ourselves and the rest of the world.
As I look to the distant past, of my Celtic ancestry, I have come to think of us all as aboriginal.All human, these lines we draw on maps and in our minds that seem to change daily confuse me no end. : P
People will tell you where they've gone
They'll tell you where to go
But till you get there yourself you never really know
Where some have found their paradise
Other's just come to harm
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Deeej wrote:
>It always amuses me how it is those people who do not live in a country (and in many cases who have never lived in it) who are they ones who most vociferously hype their credentials as ambassadors for it.<
Notably of course that doyen of the Scottish National Party who makes sure he lives in the Caribbean - Sir Sean Connery.
I dream of boys with big bulges in their trousers,
Never of girls with big bulges in their blouses.
…and look forward to meeting you in Cóito.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
marc
|
|
Needs to get a life! |
Registered: March 2003
Messages: 4729
|
|
|
Where does it actually say where the lady lives?
Did I say she didn't still maintain residence in Scotland? Nope. I checked.
Do you actually think it was a joke? Good grief!
All I can say is have a nice holiday.....
But don't try to vivisect it, you'll only spoil it for the rest of us.
Life is great for me... Most of the time... But then I meet people online... Very few are real friends... Many say they are but know nothing of what it means... Some say they are, but are so shallow...
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Well, yes; I am guilty of assuming that a 95 year-old lady does not frequently travel from one country to another. But that's why I said "assuming"! If a person lives in Scotland then there is usually no need to say that they were born there, because their actual residence, and citizenship, overrides that.
However, I would certainly regard a suggestion that the island of Britain should be renamed "Great Scotland" as a joke, yes...
David
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Ah, yes: an excellent example, Nigel. Thanks.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sean_Connery
"His involvement in Scottish politics, however, has often provoked severe criticism, since he has not actually lived in Scotland for more than fifty years."
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Sean Connery's involvement with Scottish Devolution was seen as pretty much of a joke by most of the pro-devolution Scots I worked with during the run-up to the referendum. The general sentiment seemed to be that they'd gratefully take his campaign contributions, but wished he'd either come back to Scotland to live, or keep quiet!
"The ultimate weakness of violence is that it is a descending spiral, begetting the very thing it seeks to destroy. ... Returning violence for violence multiplies violence, adding deeper darkness to a night devoid of stars." Martin Luther King
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Deeej wrote:
It always amuses me how it is those people who do not live in a country ... who are they ones who most vociferously hype their credentials as ambassadors for it.
Ouch! David, that hurt. I have not lived in the UK for almost 40 years, but I still think that it was a fantastic place to grow up in, and I still shout its praises at every opportunity.
I have visited England a few times in those 30-something years, the last time being in 2003. I must admit that it felt very strange: in many ways not at all the country of my childhood memories. I very much hope to visit the UK again next year, when I hope that you, David, will be able to show me that there is still some "Great" in Britain.
And to everyone: a very happy Xmas.
J F R
The paradox has often been noted that the United States, founded in secularism, is now the most religiose country in Christendom, while England, with an established church headed by its constitutional monarch, is among the least. (Richard Dawkins, 2006)
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
JFR,
I'm really sorry -- that remark was not meant to hurt anyone here. I was specifically meaning people like Sean Connery, or those people who live in America but claim themselves to be Irish through-and-through, despite never having been to Ireland. (I don't claim myself to be Irish myself, even Anglo-Irish, because, though I love the country, I have only spent a few weeks there over the course of my lifetime. I suppose I shouldn't call my mother Irish, either, for she has an English accent and has lived in England since she was 11 or 12.)
If you have genuine credentials for loving the UK (having been brought up there) and genuine reasons for living outside it then I don't see any hypocrisy. In your case, I would imagine (though please correct me if I'm wrong) that you live in Israel because it suits you -- which is very different from saying that the UK (or one of its constituent countries) is obviously the greatest country in the world, but being unable to justify why you don't live there.
I would very much like to meet you next time you're over here. My apologies for my poor choice of words.
Best wishes,
David
[Updated on: Sat, 23 December 2006 17:31] |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
cossie
|
 |
On fire! |
Location: Exiled in North East Engl...
Registered: July 2003
Messages: 1699
|
|
|
... I have to disagree with you, Deeej!
There is no such place as 'the island of Britain' - the biggest island in the British Isles is 'Great Britain'.
By no means the whole population of England, Wales and Scotland lives on that island; there are substantial populations on the Isle of Wight (England), Anglesey (Wales), the Inner and Outer Hebrides, Orkney and Shetland (all Scotland) - so living on the 'mainland' has nothing to do with being British.
There is a case for arguing that, in ethnic terms, anyone from any of the British Isles is British; after all, the Ancient Brits were Celts, whose linear descendants are concentrated in Wales, Scotland, Ireland and the counties of Cumbria and Cornwall in England.
It's true that anyone from the island of Ireland is entitled to describe himself as 'Irish' simply because he is from Ireland, but that does not prevent him from being British as well. Those from Northern Ireland are British in the political sense, whether they like it or not; the nationality of every native or naturalised citizen of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland (and many others besides) is 'British'. That's a matter of law.
It's also true that there is no adjective meaning 'a citizen of the United Kingdom' - but then, nor is there an adjective meaning 'a citizen if the Irish Republic'.
Though 'Eire' (which appears on coinage, etc) is the 'official' name of the Irish Republic, and was confirmed as such by an Act of the Irish Parliament in 1949, in English language documents (and the Irish Republic conducts its business in English) the term 'Republic of Ireland' is always used. The UK does not recognise the name 'Eire'; the UK Parliament's Ireland Act of 1949 defines the new republic as the 'Republic of Ireland'. Presumably this is because 'Eire' is the name of the whole island of Ireland in the Irish Gaelic language, thus potentially implying a claim to the six counties of Northern Ireland. Oh, and though the future Republic of Ireland ceased to be part of the United Kingdom in 1922, the King of the United Kingdom was also King of Ireland (and thus titular head of state, in whose name laws were enacted) until 1949, when the Republic was declared.
The political history of these islands is amazingly complex - there is even an island which is part of the United Kingdom but not part of the British Isles - it's no wonder that folks overseas find it confusing - not many Brits can understand it!
I could go on and on, but as it's the season of goodwill, I'll have pity on you all and stop there!
For a' that an' a' that,
It's comin' yet for a' that,
That man tae man, the worrld o'er
Shall brithers be, for a' that.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Cossie said,
>There is no such place as 'the island of Britain' - the biggest island in the British Isles is 'Great Britain'.
Hmm. I did in fact mean the island of Great Britain, but, for shorthand, I used "Britain". This is because -- rightly or wrongly -- virtually everyone uses them interchangeably. However, I accept your correction, Cossie!
What I meant regarding the "mainland" was that most of the islands you mention are part of English, Scottish or Welsh counties (or represent English/Scottish/Welsh counties themselves) and thus count as part of the nearby mainland (i.e. they have no particular legal rather than geographic status preventing them from being part of it).
I was not aware that legally Northern Irish people are British; I was under the impression that they (like the rest of us) had UK passports. "The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland" makes it pretty clear that Northern Ireland is not part of Great Britain. Thus it becomes horribly inconsistent if the adjective "British" extends to cover NI as well. The British, of course, like to make things complicated...
I don't think I've heard anyone arguing persusively that Celtic blood makes you British; if that were the case, those American and other former colonies made up largely of Celtic (and Anglo-Saxon, if that counts) stock would also have a case for calling themselves British, regardless of citizenship. And I suspect there are a lot of people from the ROI who would be rather upset to be called British on that basis!
David
[Updated on: Sun, 24 December 2006 13:22] |
|
|
|
|
Goto Forum:
|
] 
A Place of Safety
Search
Help
Register
Login
Home
