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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13751
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Pat, we have had this before, and before and before. You have a valid contribution to make here, but this is not the way to do it. You need to make your point. Not the article, but you.
I don't care to read the article to find out what it's about, I want to know from you why you are posting a link.
And I really do want to know why you are on this forum. Are we giving you some help because you're gay, in pain? are you here to advise? or are you here to push some agenda that is unclear to me?
I know who The Family are, but all this link seems to be about is some frolic they went on.
So what is the point you are failing to make?
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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Pat, this is very old news to activists and politicos especially here in DC. What needs immediate focus now is taking on overtly hostile organisations such as the FRC, tasking them for public statements that create situations/scenarios for at risk LGBTQ youth and others whereby they feel so hopeless as to jump in front of trucks as did a 14 year old last Friday.
Bullying is created by an atmosphere wherein people don't object to uttering(s)from those folk that validate the bullies and makes it okay to bash Gay people.
The thrust of Sharlet's article deals with the usual shady machinations of these uber conservatives but it is aimed at a wider look not specific to LGBTQ concerns although any progressive in America needs to be very alarmed at the views of 'The Family' and their campaigning overseas and quietly here to do away with a separation of church & state.
I see that it is dated September 27th... may have been useful to run it before the elections eh?
One last thing Pat, there's no "secret political arm..." virtually every member of Congress in both houses, the White House, and especially those of us in the Press Corps here in DC are fully aware of this outfit and all aspects of their operations. Sharlet's title of his book was meant to help him sell his book Pat. Most of us knew.
The immediate threat are NOM, FRC, Focus on the Family, the list goes on. These represent a clear & present danger to the Equal Rights of LGBTQ Americans as they are pushing an agenda that will lead to the LGBTQ communities across the United States being forced into a permanent state of second class citizenship. THAT should be a major concern and The Family is just a peripheral component of those efforts.
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yusime
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Likes it here |
Location: United States
Registered: April 2008
Messages: 195
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You may not understand that I behave here exactly as I do in my own life. This is how I deal with people in general. I find it irritating to try to deal with people in any form of direct context. This is how I address every issue I choose to address. This is just how my brain typically works. I very rarely start with an issue of concern because I just do not know how to deal with people in such a manner. I must go around issues to deal with reality. I can't go straight to most things. My brain will stop working after a time of trying.
The article is about the religious underpinnings of their entire world view and how it intersects with their desire to create some form of new world. Everything from installing dictators to promoting genocide to robbing the world blind. I at least thought that their genocidal tendencies would be noteworthy. I doubt that people have heard of C-Street anyways. The people mentioned in the article may never have a lasting impact on your life but their reach is global and they do a great deal of harm where they can because they believe they are trying to win some war.
He who joyfully marches in rank and file has already earned my contempt. He has been given a large brain by mistake since for him a spinal cord would suffice. Albert Einstein
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13751
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So, tell us, if you would, please, why in real life you behave in the same way? Perhaps illustrate it. Say something about a day in your life
I have heard of The Family. I have heard of C Street. And yes, I know they are interfering with things.
But I am more concerned, not about them, but about you. How do we draw you in?
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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yusime
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Likes it here |
Location: United States
Registered: April 2008
Messages: 195
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I know very well that people are more aware of the involvement of Christianity in our foreign policy today. I doubt that people who are outside of Washington DC know much about their involvement. Most people don't have the time to be interested in such a group they have more important things to do, so this is secondary if at all important.
I doubt if the actual numbers as a total percentage of gay teens committing suicide has actually risen. Media coverage has greatly increased knowledge about such an issue over the last few months though. That is the only thing that I think can be of help right now. People need to be more aware of the other people in their lives to begin to address such a topic, but until this becomes a political and moral issue that people are more than willing to discuss it will go nowhere. If most people in the US were less concerned with trying to fix the massive problems in their own lives they would have time to deal with issues like this. This will only be a top priority of progressive elites, gay people, and maybe millennials until people have the ability to pay closer attention.
This is a matter of personal dignity and of life and death, but most people are struggling to survive right now and until they are in a better position to do something I don't expect much. No one should expect desperate people to be able to concentrate on this issue while they have other priorities in their lives. People who do not have a stable life may be shocked or disappointed, but they are forced to deal with what is going on in their own lives right now. If I thought I had an answer or even the workings of a potential solution I would have weighed in on how to deal with this problem by now but I'm just as flummoxed as everyone else there is just so little I can really do.
He who joyfully marches in rank and file has already earned my contempt. He has been given a large brain by mistake since for him a spinal cord would suffice. Albert Einstein
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Pat wrote:
"I doubt if the actual numbers as a total percentage of gay teens committing suicide has actually risen. Media coverage has greatly increased knowledge about such an issue over the last few months though. That is the only thing that I think can be of help right now"
This is one thing that worries me. IS the media coverage helping? I wonder if kids reading and hearing about other kids taking this way out is not putting ideas into their heads that otherwise may not be there. I have always found most kids to be followers rather than leaders. If this is the case, then the "It gets better" videos need to be pushed to the forefront. Media coverage can have a drastic effect on people especially the young, both for the better and worse.
-Peter
[Updated on: Wed, 10 November 2010 14:30]
I prefer guys that don't come in a box.
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13751
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Peter, your point is so valid that many people are pushing behind the scenes for even better exposure of the ordinary people's videos on the It Gets Better Project.
You may wish to look at the blog there and se a comment there speaking of that self same thing and press the like button beside it.
http://www.itgetsbetterproject.com/blog/entry/the-5-most-popular-new-videos/ is the page and the comment has, currently, the top ranking. A higher ranking still will help this message get across.
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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I need to correct your wrongful assumptions about the following statements you made: " I doubt that people who are outside of Washington DC know much about their involvement. "
Recently the 'Family' has been covered on every major media outlet, LGBT Blogs and here on Tim's forum due to their membership being DIRECTLY responsible for helping quietly push the so-called "Kill/Imprison Homosexuals" legislation in Uganda.
I'm not going to bother listing them all save for this question Pat? Do you watch the Network news programmes? Its apparent that you most certainly do not bother reading or following any of the Gay Media or you'd never have posted that link to start with.
Next: "I doubt if the actual numbers as a total percentage of gay teens committing suicide has actually risen."
You're simply wrong and ill-informed. The numbers have risen and although yes, those of us in the press may be partially responsible and believe me, we journalists have indeed talked amongst ourselves about that very fact, the stark reality is that the only way to put an end to these deaths is by casting the harsh glare of the media spotlight on the CAUSES which are, in some cases indirectly contributed or directly by onerous statements made by people in, as I have previously stated, the Christian Right groups like NOM or FRC who by the way their officials have membership and ties to the so-called Family on C street.
Finally, this statement: "but I'm just as flummoxed as everyone else there is just so little I can really do."
Hmm, no you're 100% wrong Pat. If you can spare the cost of even say one trip to the store for a gallon of milk, a loaf of bread, or any other 2 items and instead stroke a cheque or get a 50 cent money order from any 7-11 store for that amount which on average for those 2 items would be right around $5.00 and send it to The Trevor Project or The Matthew Shepard Foundation then you've done something.
Think about it carefully and quit sitting in front of that bloody computer screen with a defeatist attitude. Anybody can make a difference no matter how small.
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kiwi
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Likes it here |
Location: New Zealand
Registered: August 2009
Messages: 317
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I hope you're not feeling picked on, Pat, but i've just got to put my 2 cents in here too. There is no way of really knowing for sure, but actual numbers of suicides probably have risen considerably. There is no logic in it but publicity about suicides can trigger others to follow suit - we're talking about some sick little units here and normal rules don't apply.
About 5 years ago my gorgeous nephew hung himself - Silly Little Shit, i could still smack him! This was not a gay-bullying case, there were other issues, drugs and gambling debts etc, but these only became apparent afterwards. At the time it was a total shock to everyone involved, but looking back we could've seen it coming if we'd known all the facts. (Easy to be wise afterwards). THREE of his closest friends had suicided over the previous couple of years. He always said that he'd never follow them, but he did.
A couple of years later, almost on the anniversary, my sister-in-law, his aunt, killed herself in exactly the same way. I could smack her too! She saw the devastation that his suicide caused and how it damm near killed his parents, and then she went and did the same thing. I think that they're hurting so much, they can't see outside their own pain.
I don't know what the answer is; it's going to take more than just publicity, a whole culture-shift is needed. But the It Gets Better project is a good start.
cheers
Commas matter - 'Party on Dudes' is not the same as 'Party on, Dudes'
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13751
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As you know, we have a correspondent who writes about matters like this. http://tinyurl.com/37mayld has an opinion on the matter.
The media coverage allows us all to form opinions. But the broad consensus is that, and I will shout, SOMETHING MUST BE DONE
As Kiwi knows, we cannot save them all. He was unable to save those near and dear to him. A determined suicide will die.
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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yusime
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Likes it here |
Location: United States
Registered: April 2008
Messages: 195
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I have stated before that my parents have commented on my lack of an emotional connection with them. My ability to empathize with people is limited. Whenever someone makes an overtly emotional argument I can't process it. It's like there is something between me and everyone else that prevents me from understanding people from an emotional point of view. My emotions affect me the way your's affect you but your emotions affect me differently if at all than how mine would affect you. I have a tendency to basically panic and shut down when I'm faced with too much emotion at any one time from myself or other people.
That is why I try to avoid emotionally driven topics and concern myself with things that people here would consider irrelevant at times. It has nothing to do with a desire to annoy people I really have a hard time operating in an overly emotional environment. Being able to understand emotions and how they operate from reason does not help me deal with people effectively at all. I doubt that if I had simply explained this that most people would be able to understand.
That is the main reason I try to avoid personal explanations because I have never been good at giving a personal narrative. I just can't explain my emotions to people.
He who joyfully marches in rank and file has already earned my contempt. He has been given a large brain by mistake since for him a spinal cord would suffice. Albert Einstein
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timmy
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Has no life at all |
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13751
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What you describe is, as we all are, potentially somewhere on the Aspergers scale. Of course it may be nothing to do with Aspergers at all.
So, unemotionally, tell me, please, as simply as you can, what brings you here. Are you or do you suspect you are homosexual or bisexual? Do you have things that perhaps this forum can help you work through? Do you feel comfortable telling us your age group? Are your home circumstances something you feel comfortable revealing?
Don't tell us your address or even town. That's unimportant.
Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
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So what is the point you are failing to make? 
Re: C-Street secret political arm of The Family 
And how do we alter that? 
