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You are here: Home > Forum > A Place of Safety > General Talk > So much for Christian ideals...
icon13.gif So much for Christian ideals...  [message #65331] Wed, 09 February 2011 18:16 Go to next message
chrisjames147 is currently offline  chrisjames147

Really getting into it
Location: U.S.
Registered: November 2009
Messages: 630



http://moms.today.com/_news/2011/02/08/6010373-mom-says-church-threatened-to-kick-her-out-over-gay-blog-post?gt1=43001

Yeah, we are back on the gay issue. Not that this woman's son IS gay, but he just might be and that's enough for her pastor. Someone needs to set fire to his Bible and hopefully he will be holding it when that happens.



Age appears to be best in four things; old wood best to burn, old wine to drink, old friends to trust, and old authors to read. (Sir Francis Bacon 1561-1626)
Re: So much for Christian ideals...  [message #65332 is a reply to message #65331] Wed, 09 February 2011 18:26 Go to previous messageGo to next message
timmy

Has no life at all
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13759



I LOVE this mother!



Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
Re: So much for Christian ideals...  [message #65333 is a reply to message #65331] Thu, 10 February 2011 22:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
ashley is currently offline  ashley

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Location: Sydney Australia
Registered: February 2002
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The fault isn't the RELIGION it is the PERSON who started this. You can't blame the Bible for what that man has said anymore than you can blame a Car manual for what a mechanic says.
I don't see her allowing her Son to dress as he wanted to being a pre cursor to being a full blown gay boy. He liked the costume and so he asked to wear it and she said ok?

Three hundred years ago men in France and England dressed in what we would call today rather female like clothing and I doubt that anyone saw that as bad.



People have a habit of changing your direction through life
Re: So much for Christian ideals...  [message #65336 is a reply to message #65333] Fri, 11 February 2011 12:49 Go to previous messageGo to next message
chrisjames147 is currently offline  chrisjames147

Really getting into it
Location: U.S.
Registered: November 2009
Messages: 630



The person who started this is the pastor of the church this woman attends, but he is using his Bible beliefs as a weapon against her.

In past articles this woman has never said her son is gay, only that if he is she would do nothing to condemn him. A child playing dress up at a young age could be an expression of many things including a vivid imagination.
But society has to put a label on everything and so a boy in a dress is a gay thing, and my response to that is...so what? Because of her I imagine he will grow up with a loving heart and a mind at peace.

As to the fashion trends of Europe several centuries ago that was a sign of the class structure in society. That was back in the day when men wore finery much like a male peacock and his feathers. Life was dirty back then and a man wearing lace and velvet was a pampered member of society, proof of wealth and "breeding." You might note that is the stuff which spawned revolutions and brought about rather severe modes of dress.

There are dozens of churches and different ways of approaching religion if that is your desire. I hope this woman and her son find peace in a different sanctuary. She is the kind of mother every gay boy ought to have. I applaud her stand.



Age appears to be best in four things; old wood best to burn, old wine to drink, old friends to trust, and old authors to read. (Sir Francis Bacon 1561-1626)
Re: So much for Christian ideals...  [message #65337 is a reply to message #65333] Fri, 11 February 2011 13:16 Go to previous messageGo to next message
timmy

Has no life at all
Location: UK, in Devon
Registered: February 2003
Messages: 13759



I think we have hit the difference between faith, a good and useful thing, and religion, some adherents of which pursue their own agendae, others of whom are easy to recognise as good, decent, honest folk.

I know, Ashley, that you have a profound faith, and I understand well why you have it. I know that you are happy that this faith manifests itself by your participating in well chosen religious events.

I know also that you have a strong sense of what is not right, and would never align yourself with a pastor who went against your firmly held beliefs in fairness and even handedness. You are a man of strong principles. One of those is to be against bigotry in all its many forms.

Christianity as Jesus Christ displayed it is inherently good, peaceful and gentle, built around a rock hard core. The version that christianists, the militant and self serving fools who set themselves up as false idols, put forward, that is so different from the original as to be despised and discarded.

There are, I think, more good priests than bad ones. But good priests do not make headline news.

[Updated on: Fri, 11 February 2011 13:17]




Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
icon4.gif Re: So much for Christian ideals...  [message #65338 is a reply to message #65331] Fri, 11 February 2011 20:35 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Brody Levesque is currently offline  Brody Levesque

Really getting into it
Location: US/Canada
Registered: September 2009
Messages: 733



As I read this thread I felt compelled to make some observations.

First of all, last November, I was one of the first journalists who spoke with "Sarah" aka Nerdy Apple Bottom, from Kansas City, Missouri about her child and the great "Gay" scandal/issue that resulted from her decision to allow her child to go to a Halloween costume party at his preschool dressed as a 'girl.'

Sarah also was invited to publish her blog post about the whole escapade on my website which she did and I also put her in touch with a producer at NBC News in New York that I am acquainted with. She later appeared on the Today Show as well as ending up on ABCNews' Good Morning America, and several other appearances on the various other cable networks news programmes.

The overwhelming majority of the viewers supported her, and her husband, whom is employed as a Kansas City Police Homicide Investigator, who also backed her and his son up. The main point that irked damn near everybody including myself was the crap that spewed forth from the 'church ladies' and the other Christofascists across the United States who slammed her for allowing her 5 year old to dress gender variant, never mind that he was dressing up as a cartoon character.

Then, a few weeks ago I heard from Sarah again detailing the story that Chris linked to. Was I shocked? Nope. In fact I almost could have placed a bet that what she went thru was going to take place.

Now, Ashley, I don't know you, but I do see you are from Australia, and I DO know Des quite well, so I know that you folks are having your own set of difficulties with the uber religious types. But here's the thing Ashley, in the United States, Religion IS the problem.

What's more is that respected ministers, pastors, rectors, even a limited number of Catholic priests and fewer yet bishops realise this. You in Oz do NOT have what the U. S. does in terms of non-secular hate.

I respect that you have your faith sir, but I have news for you, Christianity in this country has degenerated into a scary intolerant damn near theocratic philosophy that marches roughshod over Women's Rights, including reproductive rights, the LGBTQ community to the point that we have a damn near pandemic of suicides of adolescents and young persons, sexuality has become taboo to the point where the Christofascists have influenced law making to the point that in many states now, 13 year old teens of both sexes are being forced to register as sex offenders for sending nudie pics of themselves via their mobiles. The list goes on.

The Bible? Don't even get me started. Religious types here scream about following it and yet they Cherry pick what is applicable to the point that even I get annoyed and sometimes ask them why bash Gays but its okay to eat lobster?

I am not saying religion is bad per se, but in the U. S. A. it IS the problem.

Sarah has gone thru hell because of it because it is an institutionalised aspect of American culture and society.

Re: So much for Christian ideals...  [message #65341 is a reply to message #65338] Sat, 12 February 2011 06:17 Go to previous messageGo to next message
ray2x is currently offline  ray2x

Really getting into it
Location: USA
Registered: April 2009
Messages: 429



...and on the other side of the fence, my daughter has worn pants to kindergarten everyday as well as a great many other females at the elementary school. There is no backlash against parents who send daughters dressed in pants. If my neighbors sent their kindergarten son to school in a dress, there would definitely be hell. So why no outrage about dressing our daughter in "boys type" clothing and maybe preparing our daughter for a lesbian life but if a boy wants to wear a dress to school, it would be a national headline and every church and preacher would chime in. I think I just had my eyes opened up to the backwards world.



Raymundo
Re: So much for Christian ideals...  [message #65343 is a reply to message #65338] Sat, 12 February 2011 17:57 Go to previous message
DesDownunder is currently offline  DesDownunder

Likes it here
Location: Adelaide, South Australia
Registered: September 2010
Messages: 127



I have just seen Brody's reply to this, as such:

"I respect that you have your faith sir, but I have news for you, Christianity in this country has degenerated into a scary intolerant damn near theocratic philosophy that marches roughshod over Women's Rights, including reproductive rights, the LGBTQ community to the point that we have a damn near pandemic of suicides of adolescents and young persons, sexuality has become taboo to the point where the Christofascists have influenced law making to the point that in many states now, 13 year old teens of both sexes are being forced to register as sex offenders for sending nudie pics of themselves via their mobiles. The list goes on.

The Bible? Don't even get me started. Religious types here scream about following it and yet they Cherry pick what is applicable to the point that even I get annoyed and sometimes ask them why bash Gays but its okay to eat lobster?

I am not saying religion is bad per se, but in the U. S. A. it IS the problem. "

And I have to add, from my perspective, religion is fast becoming a severe influence on our parliament and legislation. The Australian Labour party now appears to be under the control of Catholic extremist manipulation. These people along with the equivalent members in the opposition Liberal conservative party, are the ones who are against gay marriage which has an approval of 80% amongst the Aussie public. In fact it is in my opinion that the Abrahamic religions, in their extremist missions have done and continue to do great damage to humanity and human culture world wide. In these forms I *will* say that religion is bad per se, and we in Australia are in danger from the U. S. A. exporting its problem to us, (and others.)

Religion at a personal level is not a problem, but when it is used by organised religions to make individuals conform to an interpretation of so called 'sacred texts' then we are in dire need of secular government that enforces the division of state and religion.

We must rebel against the religions' indoctrination that is being exported from the USA. Unfortunately too many people do not question their own religious indoctrination and thereby often leave the door closed to an open mind. In some cases that door is also the one to the closet.

[Updated on: Sat, 12 February 2011 17:59]




DesDownunder

Call me naive if you want, but life without trust in the goodness of others would be intolerable.

Religious indoctrination: It gets better, without it.
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