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You are here: Home > Forum > A Place of Safety > General Talk > Dangerous complacency
Dangerous complacency  [message #69910] Mon, 13 July 2015 08:46 Go to next message
Kitzyma is currently offline  Kitzyma

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In England in 1967, when homosexuality was partially decriminalised, I doubt that the average gay teenager would have expected that within his lifetime there would be a law allowing gay couples the equality of marriage. It might have been something to be desired and hoped for, but not something to be expected.

We must beware of dangerous complacency, though.

Probably, the average gay teenager of today would think it impossible or at least very unlikely that such gains in equality could be lost again within his lifetime. Yet there are possible scenarios which could cause gay people in England to be worse off than they were before 1967.

For example, here is just one possible such scenario.

In predominantly muslim countries today homosexuality is a crime which is severely punished, sometimes even involving the death penalty. The current demographics, e.g. of birth rate and immigration, indicate that within the lifetime of a modern teenager the majority of voters in England could be muslim. Thus there is at least a possibility that a parliament elected at such a time would recriminalise homosexuality.

So, although it would be nice to believe that in England we have almost won the battle equality and a degree of safety, we mustn't allow wishful thinking and complacency to lead us into assuming that the war is over.

Kit
Re: Dangerous complacency  [message #69911 is a reply to message #69910] Mon, 13 July 2015 09:31 Go to previous messageGo to next message
timmy

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An opinion that is both correct to voice and seen by 'society' as politically incorrect. Sometimes the 'impossible' must be spoken.

It is not, however, just radical Islam, though that is a clear danger to freedoms and a throwback to primitive times in a hostile land. Christianity, a slightly more modernised throwback to primitive times in a hostile land, can also have a resurgence and decide to slay us all. Laws, once made, can be unmade at the whim of society.

What we have to become is normality.

At the risk of invoking Godwin's law, the Jews in the Germany of the 1930s were part of normality. Normality alone is not enough, but what more is there?

[Updated on: Mon, 13 July 2015 09:33]




Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
Re: Dangerous complacency  [message #69912 is a reply to message #69911] Mon, 13 July 2015 09:57 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ray is currently offline  Ray

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I recall this from the last Commonwealth Games: today homosexuality is illegal in most of the otherwise beautiful countries of the Commonwealth, including one of my favourites, Uganda, which made the news because of this recently. A visit there makes the truth of these fears all the more present.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/nov/10/homosexuality-i llegal-in-41-out-of-53-commonwealth-countries-report
Re: Dangerous complacency  [message #69914 is a reply to message #69911] Mon, 13 July 2015 10:29 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kitzyma is currently offline  Kitzyma

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Yes, I agree that the potential danger is not just from radical Islam but from any radical religion. In some African countries the main danger is apparently from Evangelical Christianity.  However, I was (perhaps selfishly) just thinking about a possible scenario in England, where the threat from radical Christianity is relatively small.

Bearing in mind some possible scenarios, I think that if I were a teenager today I'd be very wary of entering into an official registered partnership or marriage. Being rather paranoid, I would wonder if such a register might itself be evidence for a prosecution under potential future anti-gay laws. Certainly, it would be a very useful list for persecutors as well as prosecutors.
Re: Dangerous complacency  [message #69915 is a reply to message #69914] Mon, 13 July 2015 11:01 Go to previous messageGo to next message
timmy

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Quote:
Kitzyma wrote on Mon, 13 July 2015 11:29Yes, I agree that the potential danger is not just from radical Islam but from any radical religion. In some African countries the main danger is apparently from Evangelical Christianity.  However, I was (perhaps selfishly) just thinking about a possible scenario in England, where the threat from radical Christianity is relatively small.

Bearing in mind some possible scenarios, I think that if I were a teenager today I'd be very wary of entering into an official registered partnership or marriage. Being rather paranoid, I would wonder if such a register might itself be evidence for a prosecution under potential future anti-gay laws. Certainly, it would be a very useful list for persecutors as well as prosecutors.

--
Back to Godwin's law, I recall reading that clubs for homosexuals were encouraged by the new ruling party in German in the 1930s, and membership lists were then used to eliminate the memberships.



Author of Queer Me! Halfway Between Flying and Crying - the true story of life for a gay boy in the Swinging Sixties in a British all male Public School
Re: Dangerous complacency  [message #69917 is a reply to message #69914] Mon, 13 July 2015 12:36 Go to previous message
larkin is currently offline  larkin

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Registered: June 2015
Messages: 58



I find interesting that countries and cultures that did not have a tradition of opposing same sex sexual encounters such as India and Uganda have clung fiercely to laws imposed on them by the British colonials regimes.

It did not take the Baptists Fundamentalist preachers visiting Uganda long to fire up everyone to the point where they increased penalties on laws already put in place by the British even though there is no history of the prohibition of this in pre-colonial Africa or Hindu India.  I would remind you that they were screaming for blood!

I would remind people that periods of enlightenment are often followed by brutal repression.  An excellent example is Weimar Germany between the 2 wars. All of the gay liberation groups we have today were present and then were quickly swept away.

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